Pianoteq 8 used just for resonances with a real sampled Piano (Page 1 of 2)

Great idea Olivier! - makes the sampled piano certainly more alive.

Other than your fine performance and wonderful overall sound!! (much enjoyed it!), this seems a fine inspiration for anyone, esp. those with some fav sampled pianos, to try Pianoteq for this exact reason. Also your supplied files will help many.

Marvellous - bravo!

......

An aside for the readers who arrive interested but see no way they can use the Mac/Logic files:

In Windows, I still find using Cakewalk (free DAW) the easiest way to place Pianoteq as a recipient of another instrument, or audio track (to 'resonate' only), by dragging it onto that other track's insert area, and right-click selecting "add as soft synth". That allows Win users easy handling of the excellent Pianoteq resonances feature. Other DAWs do it too - some do not - some similarly easy, some are fine adding Pianoteq as an insert.. different DAWs work similarly/differently or not at all yet (but more would be topic for another thread, some threads like this have come up if people still unsure would like to search for those).

In Windows you don't even need a DAW for setting up Pianoteq for resonances...

This is, how I chained Native Instruments Kontakt (use here whatever VST you want) and Pianoteq in VSTHost *)...
*) https://www.hermannseib.com/english/vsthost.htm

Make sure, you are using the VST3 version of Pianoteq 8 (standard or higher).
To have only the resonances from Pianoteq, but no other sounds, you have to disable MIDI inputs for the Pianoteq node. See screenshot how to do this.

Yes indeed absolutely fantastic feature. I like those extra ideas for it Beto!

For those having trouble, there's prob. a lot to parse but here's some info..

Currently, the caveat being, that it does not work in all DAWs (yet) - and in some, it may only work in a non-typical way (ex: in some, side chaining doesn't happen to connect or show up within Pianoteq as expected and/or only MIDI can be parsed, not audio channels - and other glitches).

I think that is primarily why it's not yet fully documented, as it's not yet fully implemented/compatible with quite a number of DAWs, including a top DAW or 2. Until it can be working more commonly across more DAWs unfortunately most threads showing it off, will end up with users trying to understand "What is going wrong in my use case.. it does not work" etc. (my main reason for inserting 'for Win users' in my 1st post above - kind of inherently knew people would ask "Why doesn't this work for me").

My preferred working strategy would be drag/drop as insert, or automatically working correctly esp. with side-chaining for all, or even automatically as an insert in an FX send!! etc.. this is stuff which is probably a shipping container full of crates full of cans full of worms but fingers crossed it can end up being easy and useful for more users in more DAWs sometime in future.

That's also just why each time I see this feature, I like to point to good old free Cakewalk for Win folks - not because I'm using Cakewalk as my main DAW, but to me as a long-time digital music hack, this feature just works in most expected ways in it, and in some other ways too (and it's one DAW in particular which I've tested and found to work easily and in various ways, like as an FX send, or as a 'soft synth', with sidechaining etc. - but others do exist, inc. Reaper which is rightly popular here.. iirc that also works well in various ways currently on Win.. other useres have had trouble with Ableton unfortunately.. and I still haven't upgraded my old version on the new machine to test that..

The new resonances feature probably has some more improvements to come, before we can confidently say "Hey, just do this it works".. because for many, currently it likely just won't work yet as expected, unless they use the same DAW as the one giving instructions.. it should not yet be said "It's easy" because many will become frustrated and frankly could end up annoyed with Pianoteq for getting it this far and releasing it before more ubiquitous implementation.. I'd hope not though, and also another reason to keep posting this kind of explanation for anyone who reads.).

I can see it being implemented eventually perhaps, as a separate "FX" (some VSTs install as the usual single main codebase but will display as both instrument and as an FX in DAW 'browsers' etc.. whether you drop in the FX version or not, the main VST is still the source. IDK, using this feature as an FX seems really appropriate, esp. on an FX channel.. so automatically recognizing "the user has inserted me as an FX on a send.. do the auto-magic." I love love, like reeeally love the way Studio One does this.. no hassles fussing around with creating arcane channels and configs nor weird sends/returns.. drag drop something onto "send" and it auto-hooks everything up as a fully functioning "FX" send channel.. and these FX channels also have their own send now.. you can send send send to oblivion - the perfect thing for "layering" many instances of resonances off to the mighty event horizon.. So for me Studio One, possibly having a top 2 or 3 spot in terms of overall users and is the most functional and easy IMHO, is where I'd hope to see it working asap - to me, it does it best, in terms of user workflows and expectations, they 'wrote VST2 and VST3' specs.. it makes sense to me. Just another concerned user type of 'requestion' for that

Also a note to self and a few others - the fact we're even talking about resonances feature at all is amazing to me - in the best way.. excellent works over the long timeline leading to it - NONE of the things I mentioned about 'how it might improve over time' should be read to infer that there's anything wrong or bad with it.. no, it's brilliant stuff - and I'm just trying to point out, in detail why it may not work yet for many.. I do hope this will come, so I will keep posting - it will be a different thread outcome in future, when it works for more users.. so I guess I'd suggest "patience" - as we've seen nothing but focus on practically making users' desires and requirements into reality, no matter at times if those use cases are not ordinary.

Currently, hassles and differences among various DAWs are preventing quite a few from enjoying the feature.. many reading try it in their own DAWs in their own ways to find it not working.. and it can be like getting stuck in circular logic.. "I did what they said but nothing", over and over.. until "Ah, I see, it's not yet compatible everywhere.. doh doh doh".. confusing for many and a kind of pain in the assessment of it all

But back to all you posted Olivier, it is excellent and the extra scripting is truly super and next-level - so very very good and so cool - delivery for Beto's request is magic - and exemplary that, possibly in the near future, we might all with our own preferred tools each find our own next-level ways to work with this new feature as well as others (without hopping and shopping extra DAWs or doing things so differently depending on which DAW.. also just to note, the ones who will find most difficulty are those without so much experience with digital recording.. so whilst many here indeed CAN just from experience know they can try various things in various ways in various DAWs, very many others will not understand "what is going wrong?", the main reason I post this, to help them understand, if they choose to read through.).

Confident that may be within a window of perhaps a year?? Not sure - but fingers are crossed it can work seamlessly so workflows are not so different depending on the DAW. 

Thank you again Olivier for your great music there too, all such brilliant inspiration. Seriously fab.

[sorry for word salads - just don't see all that context often and think maybe someone should point all that out when it applies.. I do think it will become more compatible over time as the takeaway prologue.]

Hi Olivier W,

Very nice demonstration and rendering of this beautiful piece.
What kind of MIDI strip do you use under the keybed ? The result seems good. Are you satisfied with it ?

Thank you,
Paulo

Olivier W wrote:

Hi,

Pianoteq used just for resonances with a real sampled Piano.

Steinway sound used : VSL synchron Steinway D-274, with 3 mics : Condenser + Ribbon + High
Pianoteq 8 : chained audio in Logic 10, to reproduce all noises and resonances, releases duplexe, sympathetic....

Best of the 2 world : sampling and modeling.

Pianoteq used just for resonances with a real sampled Piano :

https://youtu.be/S8wp_ba1kpU

For MAC/ LOGIC 10 users, files and script are here :
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/jakicige9ae9...BXPua?dl=0

Regards,

Olivier F.

Thanks. Quite impressed :-)

Olivier W wrote:

Paulo164 wrote:

Hi Olivier W,

Very nice demonstration and rendering of this beautiful piece.
What kind of MIDI strip do you use under the keybed ? The result seems good. Are you satisfied with it ?

Thank you,
Paulo

Thanks

I use a digital midi keyboard inside this Grand Piano.

I've made a better picture tutorial here :

Regards,

Olivier F

Hi Olivier,

What model of keyboard do you use in your grand piano shell please?

Great thread by the way. Some amazing and very interesting results!

Warmest regards,

Chris

Beto-Music wrote:

It would be nice to hear just the ressonances separated from the main sampled sounds.

hi,

You ask, and done

just quickly live done, playing live the beginning full and only with resonance (i've not recorded the midi file of previous video, i don't like midi file) :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9AVJ6kthsE

Olivier W wrote:

Hi,

The Logic Pro 10 .logix for VSL D-274 + Pianoteq 8 hybrid piano have been updated to V5.2, with full half pedal sustain and easier way to disable VSL sustain samples to have real repedal within Pianoteq 8 real Sympathetic Resonance :

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/okri68hy...uvf7y4xnfb

----------------------------
Logic 10 script :

// VSL SCRIPT to use only PEDAL UP sample for Side chain  Pianoteq 8 audio  resonance and silent key :

var SustainValue  = 0;

function HandleMIDI(event) {

if (event instanceof ControlChange && event.number == 64) {
    SustainValue  = event.value; //set the value
    }

if (event instanceof NoteOn) {
    if (event.velocity == 1) {
    event.velocity = 0;
    }
   
    var cc = new ControlChange;
    cc.number = 64;
   
    if (  SustainValue != 0){   
    cc.value = 0; //set the value // Send to VSL fake Sustain value before Note ON to not use sustain samples
    cc.send(); //send the event
    }
   
    event.send(); // send the note on as if no sustain pedal is on
   
    cc.value =   SustainValue; // correct the real sustain value
    cc.send(); //send the good sustain event
   
}else{

event.send();
}
}
----------------------
Regards,

Olivier

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/jakicige9ae9...BXPua?dl=0

Hi, Olivier! I want to try your Logic script. How hard is it to undo the changes if I need to?

zenwarlord wrote:

This is a very useful method and works like a charm in FL Studio.

new Logic 11 preset :

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/fspckzx8...h&dl=1

Olivier W wrote:

Another demo :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7JCkF2XCac

Hi Olivier,

New to the forum and late to the party but this is excellent stuff. Thanks for sharing the files. I downloaded your files in Logic and have Pianoteq side chained to VSL CFX3. With the script active and sustain pedal down, only C3 downwards work and sustain properly. I did not make any changes to the file I have loaded in Logic other than selecting a preset for VSL CFX3 since I don't have VSL Steinway. Thoughts on what could be wrong?

gfavs wrote:

Olivier W wrote:

Another demo :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7JCkF2XCac

Hi Olivier,

New to the forum and late to the party but this is excellent stuff. Thanks for sharing the files. I downloaded your files in Logic and have Pianoteq side chained to VSL CFX3. With the script active and sustain pedal down, only C3 downwards work and sustain properly. I did not make any changes to the file I have loaded in Logic other than selecting a preset for VSL CFX3 since I don't have VSL Steinway. Thoughts on what could be wrong?

send me your logic VSL CFX preset.

gfavs wrote:

Thanks for your prompt response and for taking a look. Below is the preset I'm using in VSL CFX3. I have tried multiple times but with using the script to disable VSL sustain samples for pedal down, I hear muted sounds until I get to C4. I tried uploading the entire logic file via dropbox but was unsuccessful. Does the script only work for VSL Steinway sample?

Gfavs Grand Piano.vsynpreset

Olivier W wrote:

send me your logic VSL CFX preset.

To upload .logicx in Dropbox, before you have to compress it in .zip. 
I don't have the VSl CFX but i could fix your preset without CFX samples.

Try to .zip your .logicx and send me. i will look if the script is at the right place.

gfavs wrote:

Got you. Plan sounds good. Link to Logic file below. Please, let me know if you have any issues accessing it.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/5b4gi19o...6&dl=0

Olivier W wrote:

To upload .logicx in Dropbox, before you have to compress it in .zip. 
I don't have the VSl CFX but i could fix your preset without CFX samples.

Try to .zip your .logicx and send me. i will look if the script is at the right place.

I when i open your .logicx, and load my Steinway (because i've not the Yamaha) it doesn't work too, because the SCRIPT is "off", you have just to open the mix panel windows and click on script to set it "on". (in your preset the script is off)

and check the sidechain in pIanoteq too if another problem