Organteq and phase correlation

Yes, channels show negative correlation (which I guess is natural for organ) and the goal is to maximize stereo correlation/mono compatibility. I’m not looking for a sound of "cinematic organ", nor am I trying to achieve the widest possible stereo image. I’m aiming for a balance between the natural stereo sound of a pipe organ and excellent mono compatibility.

So my question is: how can I achieve this in an acoustically correct way directly in Organteq, rather than mangling the organ by cutting frequencies, collapsing parts of it to mono (except for very low end of course), etc.?

It seems that one possible approach is to adjust the relationship between Stereo Width and C/C♯ Separation, since there is a interaction between these two parameters and this does help to some point. The problem is that I don’t know how to approach this systematically and acoustically correctly. There may also be other factors involved besides these two parameters, such as the parameters of the individual pipes themselves.

What I need are some basic rules or algorithms, even at a conceptual level—for example, "the higher you set parameter X, the lower parameter Y should be" or "the higher is parameter X for one stop/pipe, the lower it should be for another stop/pipe".

It would be absolutely wonderful if Modartt could create a "magic" phase slider, which would allow the user to adjust the stereo/phase relationship to their own taste simply by moving it.

It would also be great if moving this slider automatically adjusted the Width and C/C# sliders accordingly, so that the user could visually see exactly what was happening. The "magic slider" itself could be placed right alongside the existing Width and C/C# controls. And, of course, such a slider should take the stops currently used in the organ preset into account (and maybe some other relevant parameters). That would probably be the best solution. Who knows, maybe Modartt are already working on something like this.

By the way, I’m sure that Organteq has not been abandoned, even though it has been a very long time since the last update. Apparently, the Organteq team is simply busy working on Airteq, and I think that once it is released, we can expect some Organteq updates as well.

Of course, I can’t presume to give advice to the professionals at Modartt, but it seems to me that, at this point, Organteq needs two major updates above all: first, full Scala support, and second, this "magic slider" — essentially, a kind of mixing assistant for the natural, not "cinematic" organ sound.

Of course, the most obvious direction would be to expand the German and French organs with Spanish, English, and American organs. But in my opinion, Modartt should focus precisely on the area where Hauptwerk cannot compete with Organteq by default. If the development path is primarily focused on adding Spanish, English, and American traditions (which of course is also great, but not "a must"), I don’t think it would attract that many new users. Hauptwerk already has more than 150 organs, so there is little point in trying to compete with them on that ground. The physical modeling of an organ should beat a sample-based organ — and attract new users — precisely in the area where a sampler simply cannot offer anything.

As I already wrote above I’m not talking about phase issues caused by incorrect speaker placement/room reflections etc, but about the specific characteristics of the organ’s natural acoustics. I get these "phase issues" even with the sound turned off, as indicated by the correlation meter (just to be sure, I compared the readings from different correlation meters, specifically those from Voxengo and Brainworx).

So my aim is to prepare the phase using Organteq itself, already at the "sound coming directly from the instrument" stage, so that I don’t have to excessively mangle the sound with M/S EQ, resort to mono or stereo narrowing at certain frequencies, etc.

Actually I’m planning to release an album on vinyl (where phase is critically important), and I don’t want to leave this "problem" entirely in the hands of the mastering engineer, who will most likely care about little besides simply making the record cuttable by whatever means necessary, without compromising the cutter head or the lacquer.

I'll show it on video (audio is not really relevant here, I think):

https://youtu.be/fUE4fFATTko?si=WRnYCk0WrM5I8JH7

The EQ in the Brainworx plugin is disabled; the plugin is working in monitoring mode. The reverb in Organteq is also disabled, so we are monitoring the raw model of the "instrument in a vacuum," before the reverb, speakers/headphones, room acoustics, etc.

In the bottom-right corner you can see the correlation meter showing the phase relationship of the signal (1 = mono, 0 = maximum stereo while still being in phase, -1 = out of phase).
As you can see, the particular note being played on this stop has a "phase problem" (as I already mentioned, it is not really a problem — it is a natural characteristic of organ acoustics), with the correlation meter going below zero. Enabling another stop, as you can see, "fixes the phase", but if we play the first stop solo, we have the "problem".

As you can see later in the video, this can be solved by adjusting Width and C/C#, and it can be done very flexibly: you can get anything from practically mono to an extremely wide stereo image that is still in phase. This is actually one of those cases that demonstrates the advantage of a physical modeling instrument over sample libraries: the model itself is absolutely flexible, allowing you to achieve practically any result, including completely opposite results.

The problem is that this is not a case of "one single note being out of phase on one single stop". Even if I fix the phase of this particular note, I will still have "problems" with other notes, on other stops and on other manuals. "Fixing" the phase of every single note is obviously not an option (it will also sound horrible, as every note will have its own stereo image)

Just to add: in real life, this is probably solved by using the right microphones, in the right number, positioned at the right distances from each other and from the instrument. How exactly engineers verify that everything is properly set up before pressing the “Record” button, I have no idea, but obviously there must be some methods or formulas for doing this.

In Organteq, as I already mentioned, I think this could potentially be solved with some kind of equation, formula, or similar approach — I am not a specialist in this area — that would take into account all the stops (with their adjustements of course) of the organ assembled by the user. At the same time, phase control itself could be handled by a separate slider that would automatically adjust Width and C/C#.
Conversely, any manual adjustment of Width and C/C# by the user could automatically adjust this phase slider as well, moving it toward mono or toward out-of-phase behavior depending on what the user is doing.

This would allow the user to control the "image of the organ" with three sliders and easily find the desired balance between the phase compatibility of ALL notes/chords/stops of the organ and its stereo image — whether that means the overall stereo width or the positioning of individual pipes.

And as for vinyl — well, first I love vinyl and second my music is simply rather specific and belongs to a vinyl-oriented subculture