I'm planning to buy a new keyboard and want to make sure it's compatible with the forthcoming iOS app. Should I limit piano choices to those with USB audio? How would I connect a keyboard without USB audio to my iPad?
I'm planning to buy a new keyboard and want to make sure it's compatible with the forthcoming iOS app. Should I limit piano choices to those with USB audio? How would I connect a keyboard without USB audio to my iPad?
The connection from keyboard to iOS/Pianoteq will use MIDI. it won't be an audio connection. USB Audio won't be used. Most keyboards have either USB MIDI-to-host ports or the old-fashioned DIN (5-pin) MIDI ports, or both. Either can be used to connect to iPad, though you'll need a special cable (~$40) if you're sending from a 5-pin MIDI plug to convert it to USB.
Also, with older iOS devices having the proprietary Apple "Lightning" ports, you would want to get the Apple CCK adapter to convert to USB ( https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MK0W...ra-adapter ). If you have newer iOS device with USB-C there are various ways to connect.
I'm planning to buy a new keyboard and want to make sure it's compatible with the forthcoming iOS app. Should I limit piano choices to those with USB audio? How would I connect a keyboard without USB audio to my iPad?
I don't think you need to worry about USB audio. I would recommend USB midi, though--and most newer keyboards would have that.
The keyboard will just be sending midi data to the iPad via USB. The iPad generates the audio (with Pianoteq) and outputs that via USB to an audio interface, typically, which then sends it to headphones or speakers. The audio never goes into or comes out of the keyboard, in this scenario. But it doesn't take advantage of keyboard speakers if it has them. If you want some internal keyboard speakers to be able to output the sound, USB audio would be useful.
Also it's likely you will need a powered USB hub, and an Apple camera connector, to interface between the iPad and USB hub. Both audio interface and keyboard can then draw power from the USB hub if they need it, and won't run your iPad battery down.
It's basically identical to how you would set things up with a computer, only the iPad replaces the computer.
I'm excited about the Pianoteq iOS app. I've played with my keyboard connected to my iPad quite a bit. It was Pianoteq that caused me to switch to a laptop. However using the iPad is never as smooth as with a laptop computer. You have to be prepared for some rough edges, in my experience.
Thanks for the replies. I do want to use the piano speakers or headphones. The simplicity of a single cable between the iPad and piano is appealing.
Thanks for the replies. I do want to use the piano speakers or headphones. The simplicity of a single cable between the iPad and piano is appealing.
Ahh. Yes, if you want to use the piano/controller's speakers USB audio is one solution. The other would be to connect audio output from the iPad to an audio-in jack on the piano. (Most but not all digital pianos have audio in.) Older iPads have a built-in 1/8" audio jack; newer ones do not but there are USB adapters that can give them an audio out jack. Same jacks could be used to plug headphones into.
I use Yamaha MD-BT01 midi adapter https://uk.yamaha.com/en/products/musi...index.html
It plugs into piano’s midi ports, and iOS app sees it as bluetooth midi device (in/out). I hope PT8 for iOS will support it.
I'm planning to buy a new keyboard and want to make sure it's compatible with the forthcoming iOS app. Should I limit piano choices to those with USB audio? How would I connect a keyboard without USB audio to my iPad?
Since the Pianoteq App will be loaded into your iPad the audio signal will be coming from your iPad. Your iPad, if not one of the newest models, will have an audio/headphone Jack output and Lightning input connector. You can simply connect a 3.5mm audio Y cable from the iPad’s output and connect the other ends to your stereo, PA system or keyboard amplifier. You use a standard USB A to B(printer cable) from your keyboard to the Apple Camera Connection Kit(CCK) adapter into the Lighning cable input of your iPad. The newest iPads do not have and audio output Jack. They only have a USB ‘C’ input. You will need an audio interface to plug your keyboard in to and it will also have audio outputs in the interface to connect your iPad’s output to a stereo, PA system or keyboard amplifier. USB audio is not part of the equation.
I use Yamaha MD-BT01 midi adapter https://uk.yamaha.com/en/products/musi...index.html
It plugs into piano’s midi ports, and iOS app sees it as bluetooth midi device (in/out). I hope PT8 for iOS will support it.
Yes, I forgot about Bluetooth midi, which many digital pianos have built-in, even inexpensive models. For example, my Roland FP-10 has built-in Bluetooth midi, I can use it to play any iOS synth I want. The support for Bluetooth is built in to iOS, so I don't think Pianoteq 8 needs to do anything special for it to be used. (It can be a little confusing at first, since if app doesn't have menu items to create the Bluetooth midi connection you need to use an external app to establish it.)
I'm wondering what iOS the PT app will support - my iPad has the lightening and audio port but is running iOS 10.3.4, which is no longer updating from Apple.
Thanks
ZomZom wrote:I'm planning to buy a new keyboard and want to make sure it's compatible with the forthcoming iOS app. Should I limit piano choices to those with USB audio? How would I connect a keyboard without USB audio to my iPad?
I don't think you need to worry about USB audio. I would recommend USB midi, though--and most newer keyboards would have that.
The keyboard will just be sending midi data to the iPad via USB. The iPad generates the audio (with Pianoteq) and outputs that via USB to an audio interface, typically, which then sends it to headphones or speakers. The audio never goes into or comes out of the keyboard, in this scenario. But it doesn't take advantage of keyboard speakers if it has them. If you want some internal keyboard speakers to be able to output the sound, USB audio would be useful.Also it's likely you will need a powered USB hub, and an Apple camera connector, to interface between the iPad and USB hub. Both audio interface and keyboard can then draw power from the USB hub if they need it, and won't run your iPad battery down.
It's basically identical to how you would set things up with a computer, only the iPad replaces the computer.
I'm excited about the Pianoteq iOS app. I've played with my keyboard connected to my iPad quite a bit. It was Pianoteq that caused me to switch to a laptop. However using the iPad is never as smooth as with a laptop computer. You have to be prepared for some rough edges, in my experience.
I'm wondering what iOS the PT app will support - my iPad has the lightening and audio port but is running iOS 10.3.4, which is no longer updating from Apple.
Thanks
Sounds like you have an iPad 4. So, I'd say no, as Modartt would likely port to a later OS. It will probably be iOS 15, as even the next gen from you - iPad 5th gen can go to 15.
I went ahead and ordered a Yamaha P-515, which supports USB Audio. Now I just need to wait for Pianoteq’s iOS version to come out. (If anyone’s listening I’d be happy to Beta test!)
I went ahead and ordered a Yamaha P-515, which supports Bluetooth Audio. Now I just need to wait for Pianoteq’s iOS version to come out. (If anyone’s listening I’d be happy to Beta test!)
Just so you're aware: Bluetooth midi is a good substitute for USB midi connection. Both have low latency, USB slightly better.
But Bluetooth audio is often not a good substitute for USB audio, since Bluetooth audio has much higher latency.
For example, with USB audio you can feasibly play on your digital piano, route midi to computer running Pianoteq, and have Pianoteq sound routed back to digital piano speakers via USB audio. Latency will be low, will sound okay.
But you won't have a good experience doing the same thing with Bluetooth audio. Latency is higher, there will be noticeable gap in time between you pressing piano key and hearing the sound come back from Pianoteq. (Bluetooth audio is very useful for some things, e.g., playing an audio file background track on your computer and route it to your piano speakers; in this case the latency still high but makes no difference because you're not dealing with "real time" responsiveness to keypresses on an instrument.)
No reason to worry, P515 is excellent choice and has both USB audio and analog audio in, so you're covered whatever you want to do.
ZomZom wrote:I went ahead and ordered a Yamaha P-515, which supports Bluetooth Audio. Now I just need to wait for Pianoteq’s iOS version to come out. (If anyone’s listening I’d be happy to Beta test!)
Just so you're aware: Bluetooth midi is a good substitute for USB midi connection. Both have low latency, USB slightly better.
But Bluetooth audio is often not a good substitute for USB audio, since Bluetooth audio has much higher latency.
For example, with USB audio you can feasibly play on your digital piano, route midi to computer running Pianoteq, and have Pianoteq sound routed back to digital piano speakers via USB audio. Latency will be low, will sound okay.
But you won't have a good experience doing the same thing with Bluetooth audio. Latency is higher, there will be noticeable gap in time between you pressing piano key and hearing the sound come back from Pianoteq. (Bluetooth audio is very useful for some things, e.g., playing an audio file background track on your computer and route it to your piano speakers; in this case the latency still high but makes no difference because you're not dealing with "real time" responsiveness to keypresses on an instrument.)
No reason to worry, P515 is excellent choice and has both USB audio and analog audio in, so you're covered whatever you want to do.
I mistyped Bluetooth Audio when I meant USB Audio. I've corrected the post. Thanks for the input.
Yes you're right. So will need to think of a replacement. Question is what is the best value touchscreen tablet as a permanent interface running PT with enough processing power? Guess it will be cheaper for a Windows OS device than iOS but will need a USB connector to run my Topping D10 DAC. I don't have an external sound card. I play a Kawai VPC1 keyboard so guess that's two USB ports I need !
Flossybus wrote:I'm wondering what iOS the PT app will support - my iPad has the lightening and audio port but is running iOS 10.3.4, which is no longer updating from Apple.
ThanksSounds like you have an iPad 4. So, I'd say no, as Modartt would likely port to a later OS. It will probably be iOS 15, as even the next gen from you - iPad 5th gen can go to 15.
Yes, I forgot about Bluetooth midi, which many digital pianos have built-in, even inexpensive models. For example, my Roland FP-10 has built-in Bluetooth midi, I can use it to play any iOS synth I want.
Mine unfortunately has not BT (old Kawai), so I use this Yamaha adapter, connected to piano’s midi DIN-5 sockets - works OK.
The support for Bluetooth is built in to iOS, so I don't think Pianoteq 8 needs to do anything special for it to be used. (It can be a little confusing at first, since if app doesn't have menu items to create the Bluetooth midi connection you need to use an external app to establish it.)
Could you please specify what app you mean? My Yamaha adapter cannot be connected to iOS BT (is simply not visible in BT devices), but some midi apps see it as BT midi and then it works (these apps have BT midi among input midi devices - hence my question if PT will have such an option).
Cool. I just got a Yamaha bluetooth adapter. Just curious your connections. I understand the adapter can send midi commands to pianoeq app. Do you need a cable to send audio from iPAD to the keyboard speakers (audio in)? I'm new to this. Thanks.
hesitz wrote:Yes, I forgot about Bluetooth midi, which many digital pianos have built-in, even inexpensive models. For example, my Roland FP-10 has built-in Bluetooth midi, I can use it to play any iOS synth I want.
Mine unfortunately has not BT (old Kawai), so I use this Yamaha adapter, connected to piano’s midi DIN-5 sockets - works OK.
hesitz wrote:The support for Bluetooth is built in to iOS, so I don't think Pianoteq 8 needs to do anything special for it to be used. (It can be a little confusing at first, since if app doesn't have menu items to create the Bluetooth midi connection you need to use an external app to establish it.)
Could you please specify what app you mean? My Yamaha adapter cannot be connected to iOS BT (is simply not visible in BT devices), but some midi apps see it as BT midi and then it works (these apps have BT midi among input midi devices - hence my question if PT will have such an option).
Cool. I just got a Yamaha bluetooth adapter. Just curious your connections. I understand the adapter can send midi commands to pianoeq app. Do you need a cable to send audio from iPAD to the keyboard speakers (audio in)? I'm new to this. Thanks.
When receiving midi signal to your ipad via bluetooth there is virtually no delay but sending audio from your ipad via bluetooth is always too late for playing live. If your ipad is not recent threre is an earphones plug so you just need the proper cable to connect to the audio in of your piano. If it is more recent then you need an ligthning (or usb c) to audio converter or a compatible sound card.
john.w wrote:Cool. I just got a Yamaha bluetooth adapter. Just curious your connections. I understand the adapter can send midi commands to pianoeq app. Do you need a cable to send audio from iPAD to the keyboard speakers (audio in)? I'm new to this. Thanks.
When receiving midi signal to your ipad via bluetooth there is virtually no delay but sending audio from your ipad via bluetooth is always too late for playing live. If your ipad is not recent threre is an earphones plug so you just need the proper cable to connect to the audio in of your piano. If it is more recent then you need an ligthning (or usb c) to audio converter or a compatible sound card.
Thanks. That makes sense. My iPad Pro is 5th gen (M1 chip, 12.9" screen). Pianoteq app using a usb-c (type-c) to usb-b cable to send audio to piano speakers works now! The performance is 123 (when choosing the smallest delay). Do you think the ipad is fast enough?
The more problem is that I'm still working on how to use bluetooth midi to send audio to pians speakers. The audio output option in pianoteq is just iOS audio. If I unplug the cable, the sounds are from iPad speakers. Do you have suggestions? My piano is Yamaha CSP-150. Thanks.
The more problem is that I'm still working on how to use bluetooth midi to send audio to pians speakers. The audio output option in pianoteq is just iOS audio. If I unplug the cable, the sounds are from iPad speakers. Do you have suggestions? My piano is Yamaha CSP-150. Thanks.
I looked at your Yamaha specs. This piano gives you a lot of options! The best scenario I can see (please double check your manual):
1- buy a usb-c 3.0 hub for your pad
2- for midi: no need for Bluetooth midi. There is a USB midi host connector: just use the proper cable to connect to the hub and set PT to use it
3- there is a mention of USB audio support: It should be available through an additionnal USB connector or through the same cable as MIDI (see #2). In that case, it would appear as a new choice of audio card in PT if it follows the IOS standard. This means the piano speakers would be used whithout the need for additional audio converter.
I suggest you go in the "computer connections" section of the manual to confirm this.
****edit: there is a manual just for that!! Here is the link:
https://usa.yamaha.com/files/download/o..._om_j0.pdf
john.w wrote:The more problem is that I'm still working on how to use bluetooth midi to send audio to pians speakers. The audio output option in pianoteq is just iOS audio. If I unplug the cable, the sounds are from iPad speakers. Do you have suggestions? My piano is Yamaha CSP-150. Thanks.
I looked at your Yamaha specs. This piano gives you a lot of options! The best scenario I can see (please double check your manual):
1- buy a usb-c 3.0 hub for your pad
2- for midi: no need for Bluetooth midi. There is a USB midi host connector: just use the proper cable to connect to the hub and set PT to use it
3- there is a mention of USB audio support: It should be available through an additionnal USB connector or through the same cable as MIDI (see #2). In that case, it would appear as a new choice of audio card in PT if it follows the IOS standard. This means the piano speakers would be used whithout the need for additional audio converter.
I suggest you go in the "computer connections" section of the manual to confirm this.****edit: there is a manual just for that!! Here is the link:
https://usa.yamaha.com/files/download/o..._om_j0.pdf
Thanks for the reply. I didn't know there is even a connection manual. I have a wireless LAN adapter. I will explore them and see if one works. Basically I just wanted to try if it is possible to use pianoteq app with my piano wirelessly (no any cable).
Thanks for the reply. I didn't know there is even a connection manual. I have a wireless LAN adapter. I will explore them and see if one works. Basically I just wanted to try if it is possible to use pianoteq app with my piano wirelessly (no any cable).
Wireless LAN is no go for MIDI & audio. While away from my "home studio", I did not have my material to test PT8 on my iphone and I tried via wifi. The timings of the notes are almot always unpredictable even with my mini router being literally just under my iphone. Bluetooth midi has been reported to be reliable but wireless sound is not unless you have dedicated professional equipement.