Grand pianos demos updated with version 8.2

FYI, all grand pianos demos have been updated with version 8.2 on https://www.modartt.com/pianoteq_instruments
We hope you will enjoy them!

Philippe Guillaume wrote:

FYI, all grand pianos demos have been updated with version 8.2 on https://www.modartt.com/pianoteq_instruments
We hope you will enjoy them!

Could you please give us a bit more detail on what was changed in the piano revoicings?

Thanks

FYI, all grand pianos demos have been updated with version 8.2 on https://www.modartt.com/pianoteq_instruments
We hope you will enjoy them!

FYI, all grand pianos demos have been updated with version 8.2 on https://www.modartt.com/pianoteq_instruments
We hope you will enjoy them!

Interesting report from Pianoworld's forum member :

"Less than 1 month after my purchase of pianoteq they do this. Sigh. Im not mad at all, but that is really bad timing. I selected the Steinway B because I didn't really like the sound of any of the D models. Now, after playing the new revoiced NY D, I think its clearly better than the B and regret my decision. The D pack was already much higher value, getting 2 instruments and many more presets, including a acoustic base split that the B lacks. Which is really another instrument when you think about it. I wonder if they allow a refund so that I can reselect. Or simply change it for me. Worth a try. Anyway, I like that they are updating the sounds regularly and slowly improving the product. Its is really night and day the best piano offering on mobile devices. I own the pure piano, which is pretty nice, and the Ravenscroft (which is not the same as the desktop version, I dont like it at all TBH). It easily beats the built in CFX and Bösendorfer in my CSP-170 too. Its not even a contest, and its only 50 mb. What a great product.

I only have the Stage version right now. I was thinking of buying the Std version, then I can pick the D models, but, I was looking forward to selecting the Rhodes piano pack for that one. hmm."

Key Fumbler wrote:

Beto-Music wrote:

Interesting report from Pianoworld's forum member :

"Less than 1 month after my purchase of pianoteq they do this. Sigh. Im not mad at all, but that is really bad timing. I selected the Steinway B because I didn't really like the sound of any of the D models. Now, after playing the new revoiced NY D, I think its clearly better than the B and regret my decision. The D pack was already much higher value, getting 2 instruments and many more presets, including a acoustic base split that the B lacks. Which is really another instrument when you think about it. I wonder if they allow a refund so that I can reselect. Or simply change it for me. Worth a try. Anyway, I like that they are updating the sounds regularly and slowly improving the product. Its is really night and day the best piano offering on mobile devices. I own the pure piano, which is pretty nice, and the Ravenscroft (which is not the same as the desktop version, I dont like it at all TBH). It easily beats the built in CFX and Bösendorfer in my CSP-170 too. Its not even a contest, and its only 50 mb. What a great product.

I only have the Stage version right now. I was thinking of buying the Std version, then I can pick the D models, but, I was looking forward to selecting the Rhodes piano pack for that one. hmm."

So he's saying Woah is me, for I only have the superb Steinway B!

Seriously though can understand his frustration - he is nonetheless ALSO effectively complaining about something getting better for free!!!

I think that possibly the D model has benefitted the most, whereas B rarely sounded sharp anyway . D was my current favourite before this upgrade!
It might be a smart idea on Modartt's part to announce an extended winter sale to promote this substantial improvement that is 8.2.
Get it out on the review circuit again too. Hopefully a new piano is coming soon but who knows?

Im the piano world forum user. I'd like to restate that Im not mad at all. It's super nice to get free updates like this. Its just that I had an unfortunate timing when selecting. I spent way to long time deciding, and when I finally did, the playing field was changed just 1 month later. I did not know that Modartt changed the sound of the instruments with minor releases like this, and that it would come so soon after the 8.0 release. Anyway. I still like the Steinway B, I just rather have the new D. I guess I just need to pay up eventually. Modartt have a generous selection refund period of 14 days. So, that if you regret your decision, you can change it. I guess they have that so that ppl would not spend to much time evaluating and spend money sooner. So I really missed the mark by only 2 weeks to be precise. It probably took me 5 months to make the selection. haha. Oh well.

Key Fumbler wrote:

snurrfint wrote:

Im the piano world forum user. I'd like to restate that Im not mad at all. It's super nice to get free updates like this. Its just that I had an unfortunate timing when selecting. I spent way to long time deciding, and when I finally did, the playing field was changed just 1 month later. I did not know that Modartt changed the sound of the instruments with minor releases like this, and that it would come so soon after the 8.0 release. Anyway. I still like the Steinway B, I just rather have the new D. I guess I just need to pay up eventually. Modartt have a generous selection refund period of 14 days. So, that if you regret your decision, you can change it. I guess they have that so that ppl would not spend to much time evaluating and spend money sooner. So I really missed the mark by only 2 weeks to be precise. It probably took me 5 months to make the selection. haha. Oh well.

It's a nice problem to have! - you've already got an incredibly versatile instrument there. Only thing is with the B you might find yourself wanting to experiment with the engine and FX more than with the vast collection of presets in the two Ds.

In the end you might be glad you initially had this limitation.

Well, I only have the stage version so far. So no engine experimentation for me at the moment. I've played around with it a bit with the demo-trial, but its really time consuming and its hard to tell if a single modification made the sound better or worse. It's mostly after several small changes to many parameters that you get a completely different feel. I would love for Modartt to add som macro-sliders for each instrument like Mellow/Bright, intimate/roomy, snappy/sloppy etc that would change many parameters and effects at the same time.

Modartt have a very friendly customer support and they made a one time exeption to the 14 day rule just for me. I now own the Steinway D instead of B. I just played it again. Its fantastic, easily my favourite grand so far. I kind of hope that all the other pianos will recieve similar tweeks. Maybe they did the NY D to test the reaction from users. Since many ppl own the D and also the Hamburg version which is really similar to the old D as a backup, it was a good "beta" target?

Steinway-D was nice with you too, kindly accepting you back after you only demonstrate love after saw the "plastic surgery" results.

So... treat her like a lady.

snurrfint wrote:

Modartt have a very friendly customer support and they made a one time exeption to the 14 day rule just for me. I now own the Steinway D instead of B. I just played it again. Its fantastic, easily my favourite grand so far. I kind of hope that all the other pianos will recieve similar tweeks. Maybe they did the NY D to test the reaction from users. Since many ppl own the D and also the Hamburg version which is really similar to the old D as a backup, it was a good "beta" target?

Key Fumbler wrote:

Glad for you Snurrf.

Im also glad for me. Thanks

dickiefunk wrote:

I've been trying out v8.2 and am hearing an improvement in the new re-voiced instruments which is great news. I still find the overall sound a little static compared to a real piano and sample libraries. At work I play both Kawai and Yamaha acoustic pianos and when I play a single note there is more life to it. It sounds kinda like modulation for want of a better description when the note rings. In Pianoteq the notes just sound a little more static somehow?
I am still hearing some metallic harshness starting around an octave an a half above middle C and there are a few boxy sounding areas around the middle register which I find in all the pianos.
However, I think Pianoteq is getting better with every update and it is unbeatable in feeling like you're playing a real acoustic piano. If the tone keeps on improving I can't see myself using sample libraries for much longer! Really excited to hear how Pianoteq keeps developing!

Increasing the condition slider to about 0.5 seems to help.

Heya @dickiefunk,

Pianoteq has ways of including tools which might help you reach your desired outcome. (They often have things built in - but not everyone may have tried them, maybe just because they may seem like non-obvious for a task.) These kinds of extras may really be down to individual preferences - but I hope more can look under the hood and try some of these kinds of things out.

Here's a set of things I like to alter (to get more movement 'in the room', not so much within piano), to make notes seem to behave with a little 'Doppler-like' reflection built in - just using the recent 'Note Effects' section.

Make settings like these for each control (and of course alter to tastes/per piano/song etc..). Remember - many things you alter within Pianoteq may interract with any of your other FX. For sure, temper numbers so they meet better.. or jink them around to get more fuzzy reality instead - whatever it takes - you can get to know these kinds of things by taking notice of the way they work together for sure with a little time and focus - hoping the below helps anyone wanting the kind of things dickiefunk mentioned in the above post..

===

Modulation section:

Rate:

Try around 1.4 for something reasonable (for effect, faster rates can be interesting because less realistic)

Onset Duration:

Try around half a second (0.5 s). The modulation only kicks in per note, after sound theoretically travels to a wall - and back - and 'compresses' with still-leaving waves, to give pianist/listener a sense, like a tiny amount of Doppler-like 'bending' of pitch. Subtle - and the chosen timing set might be best adjusted to suit a tempo/song/recorded MIDI - sometimes faster/slower will seem more real of course also depending on if you are already using a very wet reverb (which indicates a large space, so go slow), or a short reverb (small space? then smaller time setting might be fortuitous).

Phase:

You may leave it at 90 or adjust to hear how it differs.. but altering it 'last' might be worthwhile (fine-tuning the feel).

===

Vibrato section:

Depth:

My best advice, for realism is to not cross beyond 2 Cents. You certainly can - esp. for certain things you aim for - but for general purposes of realism, these things are best NOT heard obviously up front - best really subtle, the hint is by far enough - going beyond might really be the point at which you're using FX - and that's OK if that's where you want to go with it.

Offset:

Try something like +0.12 or so. This will mean, when the modulation kicks in, it will first 'raise' the pitch a little.. that is like the compression mentioned above (where returning reflection waves meet the leaving waves and impart that Doppler-like pitch alteration).

===

Tremolo section:

Depth:

Again, like above - small values for realism. I have found sometimes up to 4 db is OK with some repertoires - but, I do think safest to stay around 2, or even at 1 cent. You of course can use this to make really useful amp-like fluctuations in sound design, faster etc. to be sure (esp. pushing things, using things like a couple echoes in FX section to kind of ping-pong in the quiet modulated moments or whatever - with various timings.). But - simplest realism advice might be to stick to 2-ish.

Relative phase:

I like to go somewhere to 180, listen and adjust down, and/or up to 'intuit' what seems most enjoyable for the music - it might be better closer to 90 depending on everything down to the piano/preset/song etc... this changes the way the tremolo combines with vibrato - but for sure, it does some interesting things to the way those two (Pitch and Volume modulations) interact.. a gently subtle effect here perhaps is best again for realism.

===

Attack Envelope:

This is separate to the above by itself, below. It may not be relatable within the context above.. but by itself, I find extremely powerful - so will mention... for a lot of 'close' piano recordings, instead of setting a fast FET compressor to handle the 'clippy' front of transients (it's a thing some may choose to do for a lot of transient audio.. I do this and balance 'keeping the feel of a loud attack - but temper it a tiny bit so ears do not scream'. I am not following what others do... I have been doing this for nearly 5 decades). The prob with even the fastest compressors which may do a great job at catching every transient, is that 'release' may be so short that no really good release timing will help, esp. with vivid crowded piano playing - so the FET can be less than the perfect tool for some sections, in regards to realism for sure - so lowering things so they are not so noticeable to listeners sometimes kind of defeats that singular purpose, of 'attenuating the sharpest smack of each transient'... by the time the attenuation 'works' then the realism is lessened. Just turning down the FET can just make the whole thing just sound lesser, rather than doing something good specifically for the whole signal (esp. with any further processing.. it can make somewhat bumpy the overall dynamic). There's often just a subtle point, between 'doing what works' - and 'getting it there ruins something else'.. anyway - any compression is about that kind of thing, whether it's fast or some kind of master bus tidal compression..

But - with attack envelope - I love setting it to 0.0006 and blammo.. it does a similar job, but 'per note' and no need for a FET (tiny CPU boost at very least). But - overall, even if you remain low settings, you might find it takes away more than you like from the 'life' of the piano.. and if you turn up "Hammer Noise" by a little, I find a kind of 'perfect zone' - more like what I hear from editing real pianos in studio.

I have made some fun creative 'close mic' piano sounds, by pushing attack envelope out to beyond 0.0050 and the hammer noise up to 1.5 and beyond.. every part depending on piano/preset pre-conditions and goals... but never without extreme fun in my humble opinion.

For many, the above (sections above the attack envelope stuff) may be enough stuff to try out - but for those using a whole lot more effects, maybe something about the above might also help you replace some redundancy in your templates with, to me, a more 'gentle touch' for an old FET compressor role.