Topic by Sidney Z

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Topic: Inquiry about the necessity of audio interface for pianoteq 8

Hi guys, I am a novice piano music arranger and producer who wishes to release piano music in the near future on streaming platforms. I have such a blindspot in my knowledge scope that is the hardware setting, regarding the audio interface which is an ADC/DAC function device connecting between my digital piano (as MIDI keyboard) and Macbook Air M2. 

I use Logic Pro as the DAW to record and edit piano notes and Pianoteq 8's soundbank to render effects in the DAW, a headphone inserted into my Macbook for playback listening. My critical concern is whether it will be beneficial for the Pianoteq 8's sound quality when I play and record my piano solo into DAW if I set an audio interface between the digital piano (MIDI) and my Macbook. I know for acoustic guitar and vocal parts, the ADC is an essential device for inputting sound for a better sound quality but for MIDI recording, will it be a must or redundant?

If I comprehend correctly, setting an audio interface/soundcard will have an improvement for the DAC part of playback listening only, and the ADC function won't be effective at all for a MIDI recording.

Experienced producers correct me if I am wrong and kindly share some opinions, much appreciate your replies.

Last edited by Sidney Z (19-10-2023 05:04)

Reply by Qexl

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Re: Inquiry about the necessity of audio interface for pianoteq 8

Hi Sidney,

personally I'd recommend maxing out your experiences with solo piano with what you have there - and time will kind of ping you when/if you need something extra or not. I do think plenty go and buy things they don't yet need.

Mostly if working in-the-box (and you're otherwise happy with specs), it's not too likely that solo piano (if it sounds good to you) will benefit a lot from an external audio devices by default.

If you're worried, I find Pianoteq is lighter than plenty of VSTIs and FX plugins I use, so unless you are running too many FX plugins in a session, you may be just fine with the sessions as well as your output.

You'll possibly only want to get outboard gear if you find "OK, now I want to get more multi-tracking, working smoothly with lots of other instruments and FX etc." though.. but even that depends if you use lots of FX and so on.

But, solo piano using Pianoteq on your Macbook? Probably no prob.. at least for now and until you decide for good reason due to experience "Ah, I now know I can benefit from this extra hardware and it's because of X and Y".

Just thought to add.. from my perspective an overlooked reason for getting some kind of external audio device is for the physical controls. I'm from ye old studios of the past and prefer to work with physical surfaces/controls.. allows tactile resistance as you dial in 'the sound' using your ears.. I find having to look at the screen can 'convince' the ears too often in a way, sometimes better (in which case, use that nice graphic) sometimes worse (I like the fader on my unit.. like old days + a mix of PC shortcuts, programmable mouse etc. and this can really make things a dream). I know, looking back at pointing at things with a mouse on a laptop is not my fav memories of creating music - but somewhere in the 90s that mode of working became more common - and now I like my PC and tools better than just an old studio setup or a laptop.. but each piece is my choice due to a lot of trial and error.

I guess lastly, try out some advice from others - do your online research - avoid trash reviewers just trying to brand as an influencer - and take time - experiment with what you have - you'll get there

Hope something in there helps you decide on a strategy.

Pianoteq Studio Bundle (Pro plus all instruments)  - Kawai MP11 digital piano - Yamaha HS8 monitors

Reply by jacko

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Re: Inquiry about the necessity of audio interface for pianoteq 8

Sidney Z wrote:

I know for acoustic guitar and vocal parts, the ADC is an essential device for inputting sound for a better sound quality but for MIDI recording, will it be a must or redundant?

redundant

before you release music, listen to the final mixed-down track through a variety of speakers/headphones

Reply by Luc Henrion

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Re: Inquiry about the necessity of audio interface for pianoteq 8

jacko wrote:
Sidney Z wrote:

I know for acoustic guitar and vocal parts, the ADC is an essential device for inputting sound for a better sound quality but for MIDI recording, will it be a must or redundant?

redundant

before you release music, listen to the final mixed-down track through a variety of speakers/headphones

+1 Any hardware won't add anything to the actual sound quality of Pianoteq, it will only give you a more satisfying listening experience. Maybe ;-)

Luc Henrion's Website

Reply by joannchr

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Re: Inquiry about the necessity of audio interface for pianoteq 8

Sidney Z wrote:

Hi guys, I am a novice piano music arranger and producer who wishes to release piano music in the near future on streaming platforms. I have such a blindspot in my knowledge scope that is the hardware setting, regarding the audio interface which is an ADC/DAC function device connecting between my digital piano (as MIDI keyboard) and Macbook Air M2. 

I use Logic Pro as the DAW to record and edit piano notes and Pianoteq 8's soundbank to render effects in the DAW, a headphone inserted into my Macbook for playback listening. My critical concern is whether it will be beneficial for the Pianoteq 8's sound quality when I play and record my piano solo into DAW if I set an audio interface between the digital piano (MIDI) and my Macbook. I know for acoustic guitar and vocal parts, the ADC is an essential device for inputting sound for a better sound quality but for MIDI recording, will it be a must or redundant?

If I comprehend correctly, setting an audio interface/soundcard will have an improvement for the DAC part of playback listening only, and the ADC function won't be effective at all for a MIDI recording.

Experienced producers correct me if I am wrong and kindly share some opinions, much appreciate your replies.

There are 2 distinct situations here , (1) playing (2) midi recording  and the answer to your question is different depending on which scenario you consider .

(1) for playing only , based on my own experience as Mac user , an audio interface offers 2 advantages , it reduces CPU usage on the Max as audio is processed externally , although on a silicon Mac , I am sure this has any impact given M1 and M2 Mac are real beasts .

The output sound you get out of good audio interface is definitely much better than the standard output you get from any Mac , even though Mac audio drivers and sound card is much better than window’s computers .

The other other advantage of the audio interface is that it has proper XLR lines out that allows you to output the sound to nice active speakers, whereby on a Mac , the only line out is the headphones jack which in pure hifi terms is mid quality and is designed for headphones , not external preamp or amp.

( 2) recording . In theory , at first glance , the quaility of the recorded midi file is agnostic of the quality of the audio sound card and speakers/ headphone used during the recording  . In practice , what I have noticed is that optimal sound output , improves expressiveness and overall quality of your playing in a way which is not quantifiable but certainly not null. When you think about it , the quality of your playing is influenced by the feedback you get from the key action ( weight, friction , intertia) which is transmitted to your brain milli seconds before sound is heard , vibrations ( on acoustic and simulated on some high level digital pianos ) and sound itself . This is called haptic feedback . Unfortunately it is hard to measure and quantify these advantages .

Reply by sharpnine

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Re: Inquiry about the necessity of audio interface for pianoteq 8

Hi Sidney,
I think joannchr gave a great response. I have a couple things to add.

Sidney Z wrote:

... regarding the audio interface which is an ADC/DAC function device connecting between my digital piano (as MIDI keyboard) and Macbook Air M2.

The piano connects to the Macbook, and the Macbook connects to the audio interface (with the computer in the middle). The audio interface outputs to speakers.
You are correct that for your use case, you don't need the ADC of the audio interface, only the DAC. My experience, however, is that DAC-only devices tend to have higher latency (lag) and are made for a different use than interactive playing. Audio interfaces are great for interactive playing and monitoring, and also serve to convert the (often weak) signal coming out of the Macbook into a signal that is more "pro-audio" friendly and will sound better through PA speakers or active monitors.

I keep trying so pare down and simplify my setup--it would be great to avoid having to use an audio interface on gigs, for example. It's not that it weighs much, it just adds to setup time, number of cables and complexity. But every time I try to play without the audio interface (direct out from iPad/Macbook/RPi) I am not at all happy with signal strength or quality, or latency. The audio interface really does it for me. (I use focusrite scarlett interfaces). For a home setup, where things stay put and I don't have to keep setting it up, I definitely use the audio interface.

Besides the above advantages of the interface, whether at home or on a gig, I love having an analog knob to adjust speaker output volume, and another knob to adjust headphone volume.

Reply by Coises

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Re: Inquiry about the necessity of audio interface for pianoteq 8

Sidney Z wrote:

Hi guys, I am a novice piano music arranger and producer who wishes to release piano music in the near future on streaming platforms.

[...]

My critical concern is whether it will be beneficial for the Pianoteq 8's sound quality when I play and record my piano solo into DAW if I set an audio interface between the digital piano (MIDI) and my Macbook.

The sound quality of your release won’t be affected at all by your audio interface. Pianoteq renders your MIDI to digital audio, and when you render in Logic Pro, you’ll stay entirely digital. There’s no analog audio involved at all in producing a piano track from Pianoteq.

What can matter is your ability to hear what you’re playing and playing back. As far as the MIDI input, I take it you’re connecting your keyboard to your computer using USB. Connecting through an audio interface with a MIDI input (assuming your digital piano has a MIDI output) wouldn’t change anything.¹

The quality and timing of sound you hear while playing might be improved with an audio interface, and of course your performance might change subtly if you can hear it better. If you’re experiencing latency — delay between hitting a key and hearing it sound — that’s most likely something an audio interface could improve; but if you don’t hear it or feel it, it’s not a problem.

Aside from that, the quality of your headphones, and whether the headphone output of your computer can drive them properly, is more likely to be a factor in the quality of the sound you hear than the quality of the Macbook’s built-in audio. First, make sure you have good enough headphones to really hear what you are playing / playing back. Then, make sure your computer can drive them, or add a headphone amp that can drive them. (I don’t know how good the headphone amp in a Macbook is... usually professional headphones and computer headphone outputs don’t get along so well.)

Again, none of this will affect the audio quality of the digital track you produce; but it can affect the quality of your performance, and your engineering (how you set up Pianoteq itself and any additional VST effects you add in Logic Pro — you can’t engineer what you can’t hear).

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¹ Technically, it could make a difference if you’re experiencing latency — delay between hitting a key and hearing it sound — but if that’s happening, it’s more likely to be in the audio output (in which case an interface should help, but the MIDI input probably wouldn’t be a significant part of the problem; you could leave it as is or change it to go through the interface).