SWAM Audio Modeling vs MODARTT Audio Modelling. (Page 1 of 2)

I  totally agree with you @Key Fumbler. I got hooked up with Pianoteq after spend time with Demo version of Pianoteq for months until I got enough money to buy the Studio version.

They also don't have any playable song list demo that we can click and hear on their own web other than YouTube.

Overall, I don't have any idea about the real playability of the software, and the sound.

Another thing that's great about Modartt is the Forum, and customer support, open for feedback, and update for a year. This way we all can contribute, request, and make everyone happy. That's unbeatable business model in my opinion.

Absolutely. I can't wait for future modelled virtual winds, strings and horns. That would be a dream.

An iOS version isn't compatible with our PCs. Lots of us do not have Apple products and have no intention to buy them. An odd defence for a dubious (and thankfully unusual) sales tactic.

If their products did not show promise we wouldn't be discussing them at all. It's a missed opportunity if their products are really good enough to stand up to wider scrutiny.

I don't like this complacent sales approach at all though.

righto

No doubt about it, Organteq is fantastic! If I was getting more than occasional / casual use out of it, I would definitely invest in the full version.

Can't afford SWAM ??? No probs make your own Beautiful 'SWAN'...

This is P8's Note Effects used to alter the attach envelope of a Steinberg Piano and get a most rewarding sound...

FXT available here:

https://forum.modartt.com/file/dm3nomx9

Here's what it sounds like:

https://forum.modartt.com/uploads.php?f...281%29.mp3

Thanks Stig, I'll try my best. Great playing. Remarkable sound. Feels like am sitting in some huge church. Thank you.

That's a cute synth sound Dez.

"Nothing weeps like a Cello..."

A simple experiment seems to have captured the imagination.

Here's an 'improved' version, I've added Volume mapping to alter the dying tails and subtle pitchbend...

https://forum.modartt.com/uploads.php?f...ello_2.mp3

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Thank you to:

Stig - looking forward to hearing your Organteq Saxophone.

Dulistan Heman - you're right Modartt have given us a pleasing sound engine.

Key Fumbler - LOL

Philippe Guillaume - Those 'beautiful' tails are down to Modartt and the fabulous underlying piano - a little can be done by riding a volume pedal...

Hello DEZ. I'm working on it, but now waiting for Orgtq vers. 2. I hope, suppose, there is more possibilities to work with the sound.

3 saxophone's:

https://forum.modartt.com/uploads.php?f...one%20.mp3
Best wishes,

Stig

Nice work on those out of the piano box patches, guys.

Oh, and Audio Modelling do allow demos. You have to email them and ask (i find that a bit awkward, but i guess it works for them). That's what i did when i demoed their upright bass. Was very convincing with a bow, not so much when played pizzicato. I ended up buying Modo Bass 2 for that purpose.

Cheers,
Miguel.

This is showing great promise!

I want to put in a good word for the Audio Modeling SWAM instruments. In the area of audio modeling, for the instruments they provide, they are excellent. They are the 'Modartt' of strings, brass and winds (but no, I don't believe any connection between the companies).
If you are looking for good solo instruments, they are mostly sampled, and good ones are quite expensive. SWAM instruments are priced well for their market, given the quality they provide. I have purchased the solo strings (4 instruments) and the saxophone pack (4 instruments). These packs each run around $300 with common discounts, and sometimes even less when they have sales. You can also buy individual instruments and then upgrade to a full pack at a reasonable price. I think it's a very good company and I'm so glad they are in the business. I'm hoping to get the Flutes pack if/when I find a good deal on them. It's possible to get them used (license transfer) occasionally.
All these instruments will benefit a lot from using a midi controller with multiple simultaneous expression inputs (like a breath controller). I don't have one, but make do with a couple expression pedals along with all the built-in controls on the Arturia keyboard. The SWAM user interfaces are excellent IMO. Lots of work clearly goes into them.
I also have MODO bass and drums from IK Multimedia, and the MODO acoustic bass has some advantages over the SWAM for styles like jazz.

As others have mentioned, if you have an iPad that can run Logic Pro (a newer model) you can nicely integrate Pianoteq and the SWAM instruments. SWAM sells their iPad versions at a lower price point (unlike Modartt). Personally I think Modartt's model is great--give me the whole package, all the features, and they can run on iOS, mac, linux, windows, all for a single price point. I hate having to buy again for another platform.

I will have to check out GSIs drum thingy.

Perhaps I will upload a version of the the vocal string type pad at some point. It's not as bad as I remember. I went through various versions trying to make it work well across the keyboard through different octaves and got frustrated. It's probably closest to 1970s string machines like VP330 but doesn't sound at all like those either. Possibly used sparingly people will like it.

That sound doesn't belong to what I was describing as something akin to the uncanny valley.
The term I've used there is unsatisfactory but the closest I can get. Suffice to say I've noticed numerous people don't like it when they hear something far closer to the real thing but still  nowhere near there. This as opposed to a sound that is obviously completely synthetic. I'm not talking about something that is disturbing like the true uncanny valley where people see a robotic or virtual face recreations mechanically unblinking, freakish nightmare smiles and so on. More that people find such sounds a bit rubbish or naff.
Similarly often 1990s sampled instruments were probably more "believable" than an analogue synth impression of a sound but they now sound more dated than the  timeless analogue synth sounds. Maybe that's just me!

If you have NI Reaktor you can use these  modelled, wave and sample based free ensembles in the meantime.
Check out the Chet Singer Silverwood flutes, Sax and the clarinet, Dannenberg Brass * and brand new sample derived Beauchamp Brass (Fourteen solo brasses)
https://www.native-instruments.com/en/r...ll/300659/

https://www.native-instruments.com/en/r...l/REPLACE/
EDIT-
Not forgetting this awesome freebie Synful Orchestra that doesn't even require any other program - other than your DAW and operating system:

https://www.synful.com/

Along with SWAM these are brilliant companions for Pianoteq and Organteq.

Beautiful cello part! Can you tell me which breath controller you use?

I've also seen the LEAP motion controller used with some really impressive results. It ties up an entire hand which might not be as conducive to controlling keyboard-based instruments, but for strings (probably also woodwinds, brass, etc.) it looks really slick!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDm7LqbV5No

I've picked up several alternative controllers over the years.
I must admit my leap controller is sitting in a drawer somewhere whereas the breath controller stayed from the beginning. The Leap device an be very expressive it is a fiddle to set up (pun aware comments!).
I picked up the TEC back around 9 years ago now. The bite element of the newest TEC breath controller 2 is already in the EWI and I'm not swayed by the additional head tilt functions. Some people will love it though.

For me the wind controller is better still. I consider the latter two essential part of my set up. If I had a good big polyphonic aftertouch controller I might have retired the breath controller but the wind would stay. Only because the wind controller is doing the same job with monophonic instruments.

With the LEAP having to keep the lights on bright wasn't how I like to work with the instruments. Others won't have a problem with that at all.

More LEAP bowing -
Chet Singer freebie instrument again:
https://youtu.be/kLkPvmr93K8?feature=shared

I have the Expressive Lie too - basically I prefer the physical interaction/resistance as opposed to waving the hand in the air with no resistance while relying on the light in the room for the camera system in the LEAP. Both I picked up on the cheap though. 

I would like an OSMOSE if it was just a controller. lots of people have said that elsewhere too so I imagine an OSMOSE controller could eventually be a thing. I don't want any lithium batteries to shorten it's life expectancy either - just a USB controller to plug into a computer.

Unfortunately with hardware "buy before you try" appears to be a necessary evil today. This is totally unacceptable for software though as it's completely unnecessary as no bricks and mortar stores or physical loan risks are involved, it's just taking customers for granted.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foot-in..._technique

Thanks for the links though, and I agree about physical modeling of course, though some alternatives involving samples combined with modelling and wavetable and additive synthesis blur the line.

There are also lots of + using modeling VS sample based libraries
1 - No Time to load (loading time is an issue in live performances)
2 - Takes no room on the hard drive
3 - there is one major thing that is key for Live performance (when you change preset from Sound A to Sound B on most of the synths Sound A stopped immediately when the Program change is sent In Camelot Pro it does not Sound A stays until you release the note and Sound B appear when you press the next note so smooth transition

It took me one year to save the money to buy the Audio Modeling total Bundle, and they have no equivalent on the market
All the Banks I have tried (Acoustic Sample https://www.acousticsamples.net/) Kontakt Banks they are far behind in playability
They have still a lot to improve but so far this is the best I have heard (e.g. modeling different mouthpieces ... same as Pianoteq modeling different piano brands could be the same for Selmer, Yanagisawa, for Sax, Bach for trumpets .....)
If you compare apple with apple It would cost you the same amount to get an equivalent with less playability instant loading and very little space on your drive (it can easily been installed on the main drive (for large sample library you need costly external SSD's) so if you take everything into account it a good deal even if I would like it to be cheaper their "All in Bundle" cost 1400 $ today (2150 $ if you buy the instruments separately). I bought mine 990 $ during a special offer period (Black Friday, Summer Sales) and I do not regret any $.

1 - "Currently they evidently don't offer trials, you actually have to ask them for them". (They do not directly downloadable, but they do, and I think the main reason is that they manage the licenses through their "Audio Modeling Software Center" which allow you to get the update even during the demo period).
2 - "The iOS versions are only Apple Product compatible". This is not completely true because (e.g. Camelot Pro is compatible with VST2, VST3 and AU If you are on Windows you will not get the AU plugins so if you build your scenes, Songs, Set list only with VST3 and you export it, when you will import it in IOS you will not see the plug ins (This is what I did, and I just have had to change the plugin's to AU version but everything else was OK (Backing Tracks, Instruments templates, Markers, scenes song set List) So if you are on Mac environment use AU you will have no issue to export / Import into iOS. As far as I know, no other company allows this (Main Stage only works on Mac.)
All the SWAM presets saved on MacOS can be used in the Windows version.
iOS Swam's are cheaper because some of their parameters are restricted to full version but if you have the full version on Mac or PC when importing in the iOS version all parameters are taken into account (even restricted ones)
3 - SWAM is a synthesizer product, not a massive sample library product, therefore no decent reason to not offer a demo version without having to ask for or give your email information over. Because of "Audio Modeling Software Center" you can use a dedicated mail address, not a big deal.
4 - "They have every opportunity to change their ways. I very much doubt they will but I would like to have the opportunity to try their products without feeling pressurized into buying anything. " Which pressure ? I have tried Tenor Sax, Violin, Flute, Trumpet, Trombone one year before I decide to buy the product I did not receive any pressure from audio modeling to buy anything !
5 - "iOS products are nearly always starting from a vastly cheaper price point". (some parameter cannot be changed on the iOS version unless you do the changes on the Mac or Windows version and export / import in iOS
6 - "I wish them well, and I hope they continue to grow as a company if the quality keeps improving. I also hope they improve in the sales model. As you point out, they probably won't have to if it's doing so well for them." If you look back this is what Pianoteq did If you compare Version 3 of Pianoteq with version 8 it is a different instrument they did not stop improving their product adding some new instruments, Audio Modeling is also improving timbre, playability, usability in each new version.

I have no financial interest in Audio Modeling, but they have a decent support they are making regular updates I have seen other companies with a worst approach, and they are customer oriented taking users remarks into account 

So yes they are expensive, Yes their marketing approach is probably not ideal, So What !

With all due respect to the SWAM Big Band Walkthrough ... here is yours truly playing my Hammond XB-3M (from 2001 - 22 years ago)

https://forum.modartt.com/uploads.php?f...%20You.mp3

anyone who uses SWAM instruments is wealthy and well-heeled but you don't want to wind anyone up

lol

There are enough facts on this thread to counter the misinformation. I'm out