Topic: Make new sound by layering a registration

In this video I have the registration for the solo layered 3 times (tr 1 tr2  tr3) in my daw, with the intention of making a somewhat passionate/complaining sound, suitable for funeral. Tr1 440Hz, tr2 438 Hz, tr 3 436 Hz. In this my experiment I got a bit more softer, fuller, pasionate sound compared to the normal ”single” registration Bourdon 8’ Gamba 8’ Vox Celeste 8’ Flute 8’(as seen in the video, but the sound you hear is layered registration). You probably already know that I like to experiment and therefore Organteq is like a new instrument every morning, as beautiful as the first time two years ago. I love it!

This piece Actus Tragicus BWV 106 Bach, Sonatina from Gottes zeit ist die allerbeste zeit (God `s time is the best time) was composed as early as 1707, when Bach was only 22 years old. It was probably written for the funeral of a relative of Bach’s.

Best wishes,

Stig

https://youtu.be/6uwEpyYgCVg

Last edited by Pianoteqenthusiast (16-02-2022 18:21)

Re: Make new sound by layering a registration

Stig,

There is another way of achieving the haunting, passionate sound you are searching for within a single track of you DAW.

If you load Organteq as an instrument onto your track in your DAW, you can then remove all the stops and end up with a blank canvas console. Then you can populate each of the Récit, Grand Orgue and Positif with your desired combination of stops ie Bourdon 8’, Gamba 8’, Vox Celeste 8’ and Flute 8’.

Then you right click on the Bourdon 8’ stop on the Récit manual and raise the pop-up window "Stop Edit", which by default allows you to alter the volume profile of the selected stop. There is a small panel above all the volume adjustments which says "Réc. Stop $n Volume". Clicking on this panel also allows you to select "Réc. Stop #n Detune" and this is what we want to fiddle with.

Unfortunately, it doesn't appear to allow you to detune all the notes on this stop by a set number of Hz, which would be handy, but rather by a set number of cents. Using the blue grab boxes, we will detune this particular stop by -10 cents, though you will obviously detune to taste.

If you then left click on the panel that reads "Assigned Stop" "Bourdon 8’" you can then select the "Gamba 8’" and then detune that stop by the same amount. You will note that the panel at the top left hand corner of the window "Drawknob" now reads "Récit" but with a different stop number. The remaining two stops on the Récit manual can also be detuned by -10 cents, so that all of the stops on the Récit manual are detuned by the same amount, though, of course, this doesn't need to be the case, and stops could be detuned by differing amounts to add to the interest and general enjoyment

When you left click on the "Drawknob" panel it allows you to select "Positif" and you can then detune each of the stops by -20 cents by following the previously described process.

This will leave you with all of the stops on Récit detuned -10 cents from 440Hz, the stops on the Grand Orgue are all tuned to 440Hz and all of the stops on the Positif are detuned by -20 cents from 440Hz.

The manuals can then be coupled together so that playing a note on the Grand Orgue will also sound a note on the Récit and Positif manuals, each of which each of which have been detuned with respect to 440Hz, assuming that the relevant stops have been drawn.

This should allow you to achieve the sound that you want by utilising just one track in your DAW, which is going to simplify the process of playing the haunting descant to whatever music you wish.

Of course, by using the "Drawknob" panel to select the manual and also to select the Stop number, all of this can be set up quickly within one pop-up window. However, one only realises this once one has set up a couple of stops and the trick of semi-automating the process becomes obvious.

I hope this helps, Stig, and I will admit that it was only because I enjoyed the "softer, fuller, passionate sound" that you were creating, that I went poking around under the bonnet of Organteq and came up with this.

As you say, "A new instrument every day!" 

Michael

Last edited by mprimrose (16-03-2022 05:15)
Pianoteq 8 Studio plus all Instrument packs; Organteq 2; Debian; Reaper; Carla

Re: Make new sound by layering a registration

Stig,

I probably should have checked the conversion between cents and Hz before I posted the comment above. It would appear that there are 4 cents in a Hz. However, the answer is more complicated than that as is explained in

https://harp.andrewzajac.ca/CentsHz

Therefore, to achieve your desired mix diapson = 440Hz, 338Hz and 336Hz, I think I should have set my example to Grand Orgue Diapson = 440Hz, Récit  -8 cents and Positif -16 cents.

Possibly somebody with greater expertise in the art of detuning may be able to enlighten us further. However, the end result of the setup is extremely pleasant, which is all that matters, not how correct ones analysis was in getting there.

As an added bonus, if you alter the main diapson from 440Hz to a Baroque value of 415Hz all the detunings still apply. This opens up some interesting possibilities in my endless quest for a scintillating Baroque Trumpet stop to pierce the Firmament

Michael

Pianoteq 8 Studio plus all Instrument packs; Organteq 2; Debian; Reaper; Carla

Re: Make new sound by layering a registration

mprimrose wrote:

Stig,

I probably should have checked the conversion between cents and Hz before I posted the comment above. It would appear that there are 4 cents in a Hz. However, the answer is more complicated than that as is explained in

https://harp.andrewzajac.ca/CentsHz

Therefore, to achieve your desired mix diapson = 440Hz, 338Hz and 336Hz, I think I should have set my example to Grand Orgue Diapson = 440Hz, Récit  -8 cents and Positif -16 cents.

Possibly somebody with greater expertise in the art of detuning may be able to enlighten us further. However, the end result of the setup is extremely pleasant, which is all that matters, not how correct ones analysis was in getting there.

As an added bonus, if you alter the main diapson from 440Hz to a Baroque value of 415Hz all the detunings still apply. This opens up some interesting possibilities in my endless quest for a scintillating Baroque Trumpet stop to pierce the Firmament

Michael


Thank you so much mprimrose for your explanations! Have to dig in to it and try to learn, uncover this information by studying more about Organteq. There are always things that are not immediately ”visible” and obvious  when you check in a hurry how it works. The learning curve is never ending with Modartt products and that is so wonderful.
And it goes a bit slower and slower when getting old.

But I have learned that one can do everything that one did as young (almost) but it just takes a bit longer and longer   


Pianoteqenthusiast, Organteqenthusiast, Harpteqenthusiast,

Best wishes,

Stig

Re: Make new sound by layering a registration

Stig,

I look forward to listening to your new pieces utilising this method, as your experiments are always pleasing and fascinating.

With a bit more fiddling under the bonnet. I got a more ethereal tone if I used the "Stop Edit" pop-up window to reduce the volume of all the Récit and Positif stops by 5 dB with respect to the Grand Orgue stops. The sound doesn't feel so full bodied with the the two detuned manuals ghosting the main tone from the Grand Orgue.

I noticed that, when I was playing sustained notes, the volume was pulsating up and down rather slowly; a definite beat to it but no regularity. It must have been a consequence of the various ranks being slightly out of tune with each other and causing interference, so there must have been a frequency pulse as well. The effect was rather similar to what I assume a slow fan tremulant, placed above the pipes, would produce, or perhaps a tonewheel organ, or the effect achieved by slightly detuning the oscillators on a synthesizer.

As you say both Organteq and Pianoteq are excellent methods of keeping an ageing brain active, even if it does take longer than it used to, in my case certainly, to learn new tricks. However, at least I still can, so one mustn't complain. ;p

Michael

Pianoteq 8 Studio plus all Instrument packs; Organteq 2; Debian; Reaper; Carla