I'm curious what folks are using for their basic pedal control and more. Do you need to supplement your controlling keyboard's foot pedal inputs with any other controllers ? Specifically, I've been looking at a MIDI Solutions pedal controller or expression controller to use in the MIDI line post keyboard to add damping control. Cheers.
CME GPP-3: Still one of the few, if not the only, full-blown external piano pedal solutions (especially if your MIDI keyboard doesn't have built-in progressive pedal support).
http://www.pethu.se/music/reviews.html
As stated in my review above: Good when it works, but wonky firmware and questionable support!
I'm asking because I only have the momentary sustain with my older, yet adequate, Fatar controller. Does anyone know if the combination of the Yamaha FC3 pedal and a MIDI Solutions continuous data control box would be the ticket for the so-called, progressive sustain ? The MIDI solutions box offers MIDI merge capability, so I could just pass the Fatar's MIDI output through it. Both can be had for about $150 -about the cheapest solution I can find... if the FC3 is the right pedal -it's called "dual zone" with "...continuous sustain performing exactly as an acoustic piano would. Unlike most common pedals, the FC3 has a unique continuous zone that allows for different types of sustain."
Found my answer, thankyou, after much searching. Yamaha didn't have the manual or any specs available online for the FC3, but I found a blurb about it on a Yamaha Motif pdf*: "The FC3 sends sustain data values 0 through 127 for cc064,
which is different from the FC4 or FC5. The FC4/5 are simply sending “On” or “Off” (0 or 127) values – like most typical momentary sustain pedals." Now... this is actually not true (so, don't always trust company tech writers) as the pedal has a TRS plug and not a MIDI plug and only acts as an expression pedal, no doubt. But I believe that means it will work with the MS controller box and give me the solution for continuous damper control. Really, it's just an expression pedal with a spring and a piano pedal feel/look. Can I have an affirmation...?
*http://files2.keyfax.com/XSPDFs/halfdamper.pdf
I'm in the same boat as you. - I have a StudioLogic SL-990 Pro, which is adequate - but doesn't have a continuous input, for a continuous sustain pedal. (Plus my current on/off pedal is broken so I need to buy a new one anyway).
I just had a look at the MIDI Solutions Pedal Controller with the Yamaha FC3 Pedal. - It looks like this would be just the job - although I'd want to test the whole scenario before purchasing it.
Compared to the CME GPP-3 solution, it's a heck of a lot more expensive though - and you only get one pedal verses the CME's 3.
The Pedal Controller box alone works out at about £115 (in the UK), plus the price of the Yamaha FC3 Pedal £39.99 (in the UK) - so you're talking roughly £155, verses about £69 for the CME 3-Pedal solution.
- Although, I dare say it may prove more reliable than some others have indicated with the CME pedal box!
I'd be interested to hear from anyone who has tried this set-up.
Hmmmm... I actually had thought the CME pedal was a lot more, but I see I can get it for $99. And the Midi Solutions box plus FC3 together is actually about $165. Still.. Midi Solutions is a rock solid performer -I have several other boxes by them and they are programmable via the computer. The CME doesn't have MIDI merge capability, but I suppose you could use the USB connection. Anyone know if there are any issues with using multiple USB inputs on the computer for different MIDI inputs such as the CME & a keyboard ? The other reason I like the MIDI Solutions box is that I could use it with my MIDI wind controller, but that's WAY off topic....
I have a StudioLogic SL-990 Pro, which is adequate - but doesn't have a continuous input, for a continuous sustain pedal.
BTW, I'm also assuming that I can remap the sustain controller that I use with my Fatar to control una corda (soft pedal to me, since my acoustic is an upright) and the FC3 would thence control the damper. The CME solution looks good, but I'm leery of its bugs. A couple more reviews here: http://reviews.harmony-central.com/revi.../GPP3/10/1
I take 'em all with a grain of salt, but still........
I continue to work with CME to try to get my GPP3 pedal working. The midi output failed last December. They keep telling me to try things like cut traces and short out diodes. Nothing works. I get the sense they're completely clueless. Meanwhile, though, the standard outs work, so it's not a complete loss.
If there was an alternative, I'd go with that in a minute.
BTW, I'm also assuming that I can remap the sustain controller that I use with my Fatar to control una corda (soft pedal to me, since my acoustic is an upright) and the FC3 would thence control the damper
Mmmm - not sure. You'd have to read the two pages of A4 that's described as a manual that came with your controller. Studiologic SL 990 Manual here:
http://www.studiologic.net/manuals-fata...manual.pdf
You may have to remap the output via software if your Fatar won't do it (I've used MIDI monitor in the past on OSX but I'm sure there's lots of utilities that do the same thing)
Another vote against the CME pedals. It's nice and heavy, doesn't move around when you play it, and it looks fairly sharp if you like plastic-simulated wood grain, but other than that the best I can say about the unit I bought is that is worked well for a while. The right pedal developed an annoying mechanical squeak that maybe could have been fixed, but the electronics also started to deteriorate so I never bothered to investigate. Right now, the usb connector is crapped out entirely. MIDI works but one of the pedals is permanantly stuck with the wrong polarity and won't go back no matter how many resets I try. Another of the pedals sometimes sends two of every MIDI message (this doesn't affect the actual playing, but it didn't used to do this, and it's not a good sign). All of these problems have been reported by other customers, and CME's tech support is no help.
At least the unit is heavy enough to use as a door stop, so it's not entirely useless.
Bah! CME are cheap chinese crap
I have the CME UF7 master keyboard, and it has similar "quirks" (eg the USB midi connection has never worked)
I wish a decent manufacturer would produce products with the same functionality though!
(e.g. the UF7 has a midi breath controller input, not something I've found anywhere else since the Yamaha DX7!)
Bah! CME are cheap chinese crap
Oh dear... After my failed soldering attempt on my existing sustain pedal, I finally took the plunge and ordered the CME pedal.
First impressions: - It's heavy, so it won't move around when playing. - Great!
The construction is fairly robust and put together well, so it looks and feels the business. So far, so good...
Then we get onto the functionality...
I plugged it in, and turned it on, and - nothing! - I messed around with it for about 20 mins, to discover the on/off switch is wired the wrong way around. - Ie 'on' is 'off' and vice versa! - I therefore put it in the 'off' position and tried the pedals. The sustain seemed to work ok, but the other two pedals seemed to be intermittent. - So I tried resetting the unit as described in the manual by kneeling on all 3 pedals simultaneously (not very comfortable - they really should provide shin pads in the box for performing this manoeuvre). It still seemed to not work right, so tried reversing the polarity of the offending pedals by pressing them first, then manually clicking the pedals in the pianoteq software to return them to rest. - Hurrah! - This seemed to do the trick, and they all finally work as expected.
I then had a couple of hours of trouble-free playing.
Hopefully the initial setup was just a glitch, and it should now work without any further intervention. - I guess only time will tell...
As I posted on another thread, I had to flash program new firmware into my GPP-3 via the USB connection to get it to work reliably - which it does now. Here's a related thread on another forum: http://www.cme-pro.com/forum/viewthread...a=page%3D1
Thanks for the link - very useful!
Did you read this: http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/viewtopic...d=551#p551 ? (Fatar VFP3 3-pedals)
^ Epic bump! LOL
Anyway... http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbthre...cs/697807/
Well comprimises are made if one is trying to get an electronic instrument to sound and feel like a real instrument.
It's a never ending chase and eventually you just get the sound/feel you like and be done with it.
Half pedalling gets talked about but I played recitals and classical the first 18 years of my life and never came across that techniquee once.
I seriously doubt anyone here is a Concert Pianist either, so no need to pose.
The MIDI Solutions F8 will do whatever you want it to do using expression pedals, footswitch pedals, ribbon controllers, joysticks, and also add extra controls.
I perform live and use footswitch pedals to change my keyswitched articulations because 2 hands are required at my gigs.
I also stack footswitches on top of sustain pedals for Harmonic pedalling or sostenuto when I need low end drones or mid range chords during ragtime/Orleans style Piano playing.
If you are serious about using pedals in a live format or even for better recordings the F8 will do whatever you want.
A regular sustain pedal can have a footswitch velcroed to the top so one foot can use the ball of your foot for harmonic or sostenuto, and your heel can do sustain, or even on/off portamento, pretty much whatever works best.
Also an expression pedal with a footswitch on top is used for swelling a group of drawbars, and the Rotary cabinet speed is the footswitch.
Pulling back puts the drawbars at the first ( collapsed ) setting, then pushing forward swells them along w/ velocity curves so each drawbar seperately goes to the exact destination, not just open or closed. Then the ball of your foot is to change rotary speeds.
At any rate this is what you'll see on any touring rig or live rig where one must cover strings, horns and several other instruments.
A Kurzweil Expressionmate is another crucial piece of kit. Not the cheap piece of junk they sell now, but the older one w/ the Controller desktop module. I do bi directional glides, trigger arpeggios, etc. It has mulitple zones.
I use the worthless M Audio KS88's because they have fast accurate MIDI and excessive controls. Sure the action sucks just like every other controller out there. None of them are any good IMHO. FP40 Wood by Fatar is heavy, but who cares...? It still is far from a real Piano action so I don't waste time looking for the " perfect " action. It doesn't exist.
Besides from playing classical and doing many recitals I learned to play on Pianos I never had a a chance to warm up on. That's what happens to perfromers. You just do it, and use whatever hand your dealt.
Does anyone honestly think Concert Pianists drag around a 9 foot Steinway....? NOT. They do get a chance to warm up though as they are famous, but they play whatever is at that particular Hall.
You never hear them whine about anything other than the tuning.....WHy? Because they actually play the Piano and wouldn't touch some cheezy sequencer or Roland VPiano, what a joke of a Piano.
At the end of the day you either make music or excuses.
But if you're serious about pedalling you must realize these 40 dollar Chinese toys are junk and they suck. Get the F8 like they use on the big jobs. It will do whatever you want.
Perfect for PianoTeq's Model. PTeq actuallay feels more like a Piano than any Chiggabyte sample Library, so treat it with respect and break into the vault and buy the right tools. Otherwise you will keep buying cheap pieces of - and be frustrated everytine you play.
Sorry for seeming like a jerk, but everytime I visit a forum I remember the PITA crap I went through everytime I bought another toy or junk controller. They are all pieces of crap so just make it happen with the F8 and be done with it.
http://forums.planetz.com/viewtopic.php...t&sd=a
Here's a view of the drawbar stack, it's a synth forum so I don't have the sus/sos/harmonic stack, but you'll get the idea.
And try and get your hands on an Expressionmate, the old one. It's so easy to control a chromatic upwards arpeggio by holding a pedal and dragging a finger. There's so many MIDI tricks out there and to not use them is like going to a gunfight with a knife.
CiaoMein.
I am looking for a dynamic pedal, 3 or 4 in a row of them to be exact, that would suffice me.
Yeah unrealistic I know now... bought a Roland DP-10 and found out that my M-Audio sustain inputs (yes 2!) _both_ use only on/off! Of course the manual doesn't mention _any_ word about _that_. So I'm using the expression input which works fine 0,1,2...126,127
If you are in doubt about what the pedal(s) you have actually are and DO you could monitor them with Midi-ox.
You could probably "train" with it too, to find where 1/4 1/2, 3/4 etc actually ARE (and feel to be).
This DOES work under Vista, although I think their only claim is XP and Win-2000.
Midi Yoke is useful too.
Well I'd actually prefer to know if the keyboard accepts continous signals as well....
My old CME pedal finally failed completely. So I bought another. (shrugs) That one is still working fine. For now. I use the USB out straight into my laptop.
And yes, being able to partial-pedal is wonderful.
How with a controller midi hardware change preset A to preset B (and preset B to preset A) ?
Thanks
PS
because Right Click give me a "help" and not Assign midi Control
AudioFront triple pedal USB interface with Yamaha's new version pedals (1 X switch version for Una Cords and 1 X continuous for half pedalling). The new pedals are identifiable as they are more rubbery rather than plastic. And they are quieter too!
I also have a Roland triple pedal which also works very well with the AudioFront interface. This Roland triple pedal would serve your purpose nutela and it is very accurate and well built (not glitchy).
https://www.roland.com/us/products/rpu-3/
https://www.audiofront.net/MIDIExpression.php
Warmest regards,
Chris