Topic by Sharkbat

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Topic: Questions for Keyboards for Pianoteq

Tl;dr: My questions are as follows:

1. How does the action on the Roland FP-90 (the PHA-50) and the Yamaha P515 (the NWX) compare with the StudioLogic SL88 Studio (the Fatar TP/100LR) and the Roland PHA-4 action, particularly as regards relative heaviness?

2. Can you play Pianoteq through the built-in speakers of the Roland FP-90 successfully?

See below for more context.

Hi everyone,

I know there are several threads regarding which keyboard to get for Pianoteq on the forum, but I haven’t quite been able to find answers to my questions yet, so here are some specific questions that I have.

I’m trying to upgrade to a serious digital piano setup right now (one that could last me for at least several years), with a budget of around $2000, ideally including accessories. I’ve been using a StudioLogic SL88 Studio keyboard for my setup for the past couple of years, but I find that there are too many issues with this keyboard. They seem like quality control issues with this unit rather than with the model as a whole, but I haven’t been able to get them fixed. This keyboard has a Fatar TP/100LR action in it, and I’d like to know how the keyboards I’m considering compare to that.

My top two current contenders are the Yamaha P515 and the Roland FP-90, leaning towards the Roland. I have an opportunity to acquire a new Roland keyboard for a price comparable to the Yamaha, so that when I add the furniture stand and the triple pedal unit it comes out to around $2000. I’ve been told that the Yamaha NWX action and the Roland FP-90’s PHA-50 action are both great, but that the NWX is very heavy and the PHA-50 is fairly light, but heavier than Roland’s PHA-4 (which I have tried in person - I haven’t tried the other actions in person). I do seem to prefer lighter actions when I go to stores. I like the PHA-4 but it might be a little too light.

Can someone confirm if that seems right, and how they compare to the Fatar action? People seem not to like this particular Fatar action that much right now compared to higher end actions in Kawai, Roland and Yamaha instruments. I’d consider the Fatar action pretty heavy, but I don’t know how it compares to the others. I can’t go try anything myself right now since all the stores are closed for Coronavirus lockdown here in California.

The other question I had is whether it is possible to play Pianoteq through the built-in speakers on the FP-90. I’m running my system on a Microsoft Surface Pro 5. The computer USB port on the FP-90 sends midi to a computer, so I can use it as a controller for Pianoteq, but it doesn’t accept audio from the computer the way the P515 does. People seem to like the speakers a lot better on the FP-90, but it sounds like you have to use bluetooth to play audio from a computer or tablet/phone through those speakers, and I would think that there would be too much latency to do real-time playing through that setup. This is not a deal breaker either way and I care more about how the action feels, but it would be nice if I could play through the built-in speakers sometimes. Roland advertises this for playing music from your phone to play along to, where bluetooth latency wouldn't matter, but I’m not really interested in that.

I’m mostly interested in classical solo playing (mostly for myself right now), at the intermediate to early advanced levels and that I could grow with for a while, though right now I’m not looking to learn really complicated pieces. I’d also be using it as a studio controller for piano parts in tracks I write. I have other keyboards for other kinds of parts, as I prefer semi-weighted keys for non-piano sounds.

Thanks for any help!

Richard

Reply by sigasa

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Re: Questions for Keyboards for Pianoteq

Hi Richard,

I own a Yamaha 515WH. It is very solidly built. When comparing with the Roland FP90 which I have played also, there is a particular difference that stands out to me as a pianist. The escapement simulation. The escapement simulation of the Roland is much more pronounced than that of the Yamaha. The Yamaha's escapement simulation is much more subtle and, dare I say, spongey/rubbery. In "normal" playing this is not so much a problem, but to be honest, personally I would have preferred a more definite escapement feel like that if the FP90. I think out of these two pianos I would have preferred the FP90 rather than the P515. But if you don't like to feel the escapement, you'd probably be better off with a P515.

Do plenty of research on line Richard. Maybe you could make an arrangement with a musical instrument retailer whereby, as it's lockdown at the moment and you cannot demo in-store, you could purchase on the understanding that if the instrument where not suitable for you on receipt and demo at home, you could maybe swap out for the other / another.

Anyway, as I say, do plenty of research before you part with your cash.

Hope this helps,

Warmest regards,

Chris

Reply by Zaskar

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Re: Questions for Keyboards for Pianoteq

Regarding your second question:

Besides a mic input the FP-90 also has a 3.5mm stereo line-in jack and a local-off feature.
Therefore you just need to connect the headphone output of your surface to the line-in input of the FP-90.
Don't forget to turn off "Local Control" in order to prevent the in-built sound to be played through the speakers as well.

"Very funny, Scotty. Now beam down my clothes."

Reply by Sharkbat

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Re: Questions for Keyboards for Pianoteq

Thanks for the input! This is helpful.

Everything I'm seeing online and from what experience I do have to compare to is telling me that the FP-90 is the one I should get, so that will probably be the one I wind up with. I still have a month or so before I actually get something, so I'll keep doing research in the meantime.

Richard

Reply by PaptainClanet

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Re: Questions for Keyboards for Pianoteq

Sharkbat wrote:

Thanks for the input! This is helpful.

Everything I'm seeing online and from what experience I do have to compare to is telling me that the FP-90 is the one I should get, so that will probably be the one I wind up with. I still have a month or so before I actually get something, so I'll keep doing research in the meantime.

Richard

I have a Kawai ES8 with the RHiii action which is good, but I've heard that Roland's PHA-50 action is pretty much the best plastic folded action around. Longer pivot lengths than kawai/yamaha, from what I understand.

Reply by peterws

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Re: Questions for Keyboards for Pianoteq

Sharkbat wrote:

Thanks for the input! This is helpful.

Everything I'm seeing online and from what experience I do have to compare to is telling me that the FP-90 is the one I should get, so that will probably be the one I wind up with. I still have a month or so before I actually get something, so I'll keep doing research in the meantime.

Richard

I recently bought a piano to play Pianoteq on; the 515.

I bought 4 years previously an FP50.  The action was very good, but the voices!  I repented at leisure, and utilised Pianoteq instead.  It was a most excellent controller.
The action on the 515 was that bit different; hard to explain but it had a quality I was unused to that I liked, so I bought it.
When I'd sorted the voices out, I found them excellent; a good range of different sounding pianos, so surprising these days on a digital.
Pianoteq on the 515 was hard work, the keyboard generates only up to 100 instead of 127 so it requires some thought and imagination when setting up, but you will get there eventually!
However, it does sound decent through the piano's speakers.

Just something else for you to chew over!

Last edited by peterws (21-04-2020 09:16)
I'm playing all the right notes but not necessarily in the right order

Reply by sigasa

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Re: Questions for Keyboards for Pianoteq

peterws wrote:
Sharkbat wrote:

Thanks for the input! This is helpful.

Everything I'm seeing online and from what experience I do have to compare to is telling me that the FP-90 is the one I should get, so that will probably be the one I wind up with. I still have a month or so before I actually get something, so I'll keep doing research in the meantime.

Richard

I recently bought a piano to play Pianoteq on; the 515.

I bought 4 years previously an FP50.  The action was very good, but the voices!  I repented at leisure, and utilised Pianoteq instead.  It was a most excellent controller.
The action on the 515 was that bit different; hard to explain but it had a quality I was unused to that I liked, so I bought it.
When I'd sorted the voices out, I found them excellent; a good range of different sounding pianos, so surprising these days on a digital.
Pianoteq on the 515 was hard work, the keyboard generates only up to 100 instead of 127 so it requires some thought and imagination when setting up, but you will get there eventually!
However, it does sound decent through the piano's speakers.

Just something else for you to chew over!

I must admit, the P515 is very well built and of excellent quality. The keys themselves are finished beautifully and the imitation ivory and ebony key surfaces are very nice indeed. And there's no sign of key friction irregularities, very uniform and smooth key response. Hope this helps

Last edited by sigasa (21-04-2020 17:29)