Topic: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

Pianoteq can load true-stereo Impulse Response (IR's), which is great.
The manual is unclear, but is seems PT can load both .wav and .aiff files, in all common bitdepth (16,24,32) and sample-rates(44,48,96 others not tested)
Also: it can load multichannel files. Haven't tested this yet, but I presume that e.g. a 4channel IR will put a mono to mono reverb on first 4 microphones if used with 4 outputs.
True-stereo IR's (both channels are processed with a stereo IR) can be loaded by dropping the Left-channel IR of a True Stereo file onto the Reverb-window: the True Stereo IR needs to consist of 2 stereofiles, with the names ending in -L.wav and -R.wav. (probably also -L.aiff and -R.aiff ).
My problem: this is sometimes working, and sometimes not. If it's not working PT says 2 ch file loaded, if it is working it says 2x2 truestereo loaded.
Sometimes it's even complaining about IR's not being a real .wav file, even when they are; also it's picky about naming, _L.wav and _R.wav or L.wav and R.wav are not working.
My guess is that there's some flag inside the .wav file, but I don't know how to set this or how to fix this.
If you want to try: these are working true stereo IR's : http://www.samplicity.com/bricasti-m7-i...responses/ I tried the 32bit 48kHz version.
I made some IR's edited with Samplitude in the past: they work, the IR's I edited with Samplemanager (audiofile-engineering) on a Mac don't work. I'm on a Mac.
Any idea's?

MP11SE, FP30; Pianoteq on Mac, Windows, Linux
Unheard Music Concepts

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

Found the solution: PT cannot load a true stereo IR with an extra dot (.) in the name.
So, e.g. "Hall 3.4s -L.aif" & "Hall 3.4 -R.aif" will not load as true stereo IR, but renamed to  "Hall 3,4s -L.aif" & "Hall 3,4 -R.aif" it will work.

Last edited by Marc Verhoeven (07-07-2018 21:55)
MP11SE, FP30; Pianoteq on Mac, Windows, Linux
Unheard Music Concepts

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

Thank you, Marc, for spotting that issue, we will fix it.

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

That's a really great feature - looking forward to trying it out with the Samplicity IRs. I wonder if it will work with these files, which I believe may also be true stereo, but have 'a' and 'b' in the filenames: http://www.openairlib.net/auralizationd...-cathedral

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

julien wrote:

Thank you, Marc, for spotting that issue, we will fix it.

When you're at it: would be nice if PT could also load .L.wav/.R.wav; L.wav R.wav; _L.wav/_R.wav

Another idea: compatibility with .SDIR format (Logic Audio). The are basicically AIFC files, just renaming them to .wav or.aiff is enough to get the mono-stereo ones loaded. There are also some, 5 or 6, true stereo  SDIR IR's, not enough for the hassle to get them load as 2x2.

Something really cool would be if PT would be able to load Bformat IR's. Those are are all over the net, a lot are in the openair lib, and possibly very usefull for users that use more than 2 audio-outputs.

At any rate: update the manual/ or website with precise info about what can be loaded as Impulse Response, possible formats, channel arrangements etc. It took a lot of time to find these things out (it was also very gratifying in the end, so I'm not complaining, I live in another hall every hour ;-)

MP11SE, FP30; Pianoteq on Mac, Windows, Linux
Unheard Music Concepts

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

dazric wrote:

That's a really great feature - looking forward to trying it out with the Samplicity IRs. I wonder if it will work with these files, which I believe may also be true stereo, but have 'a' and 'b' in the filenames: http://www.openairlib.net/auralizationd...-cathedral

For true stereo you need 2 stereo files. The way this is done: on the left side of the stage is a loudspeaker, which emits the testsignal; this is recorded by 2 microphones in the hall; one on the left side, the other on the right side: this recording is the -L.wav stereo file; after that: a loudspeaker on the right side of the stage emits a signal which is recorded by the same 2 mic's; gives the -R.wav stereo file.
If you look at the diagram of the lady-chapel-st-albans-cathedral IR recording you see that it's done in a very a-symetrical way; you can combine the A and B stereo's IR's but it will sound kinda weird.
(for fun: just change the name, so they end with -L.wav and -R.wav).
With some soundediting tricks it's possibe in this case to make a believable true stereo IR, but it's not recorded, which is a pity.

MP11SE, FP30; Pianoteq on Mac, Windows, Linux
Unheard Music Concepts

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

That's interesting about the St. Albans IRs. It's a pity they didn't record the true stereo, because it's quite a nice reverb. A missed opportunity!

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

thanks a lot for contributing this thread.  i lately became interested in exploring the IR part of the reverb effect but had no idea what to do.  this discussion made it easy.  there are some truly beautiful effects available with the Samplicity IRs.

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

I guess I am confused.  To get true stereo, I need to load both -R and -L wav files? 

Currently when I load the first file (eg. "-R.wav"), Pianoteq says "Impulse loaded, 2x2 (true stereo) channels, ..."
So do I then still need to load the "-L.wav" file?   Adding the second file doesn't change the message, so I am not
really sure what is going on.

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

Sorry for the bump.  Still wondering the appropriate way to get stereo impulse response files loaded.  I did not see anything in the user manual.  Thanks.

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

Hi scorpio,


If you drag in

same-name-impulse-reverb-file-except-the-L.wav

Pianoteq silently helps and auto-loads the

same-name-impulse-reverb-file-except-the-R.wav

as long as if in the same directory, and vice versa, whether you drag the R or L file, Pianoteq knows to pair them.


When changing an IR reverb file, I'd suggest to always momentarily halt any midi playback and default back to a standard reverb (select something like 'Clean Studio') - then proceed to change your IR reverbs - do this for each change you want to make.

I found that for example, beginning with a preset using quad files OR with midi in playback, dragging in L or R etc sometimes didn't change anything.

But, if you remember to refresh like that, the IR file you next drag in should work as expected.


BTW - If you want to use just one of these files by itself, for effect you might want reverb to wash on the right side, you can make a copy of the audio-R.wav file and change the name of this to remove the L or R at the end (like now just audio.wav), then drag/drop that in and it works as a single stereo IR file (with likely more right side reverb wash) without Pianoteq auto-pairing them.

If any improvement to usability comes to mind, other than walk-throughs or examples in manual:

Feedback in the recent files list (inside the reverb/"use WAV Impulse" menu) may be an improvement in terms of understanding what's loaded.

Currently if you drag in a "filename-L.wav" file, the recent list only shows that file as having being loaded (ignoring the R version - it shouldn't matter per se but, it may be confusing, as per 'what's really been loaded?), whereas, maybe an entry like:

File-name-L.wav **

with 2 asterisks to denote successful stereo pair matching or

File-name-L.wav *

to denote a missing R or L match, or maybe better

File-name-R.wav - L
File-name-R.wav - R
File-name-R.wav - L&R

?

The feature is marvelous and implementation is made as simple as a drag-drop and I prefer it to other IR reverbs for ideal reproduction of the IR space.

Last edited by Qexl (27-02-2019 05:27)
Pianoteq Studio Bundle (Pro plus all instruments)  - Kawai MP11 digital piano - Yamaha HS8 monitors

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

Thank you, Qexl.  Excellent information.

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

I enjoy knock.wav for simulating the reverb withing the piano's own case (I can't remember from where I downloaded it).

David

- David

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

dklein wrote:

I enjoy knock.wav for simulating the reverb withing the piano's own case (I can't remember from where I downloaded it).

knock.wav, originally posted by Gilles in this thread, is available here, though it seems questionable whether it's still needed under 6.x... David, have you tried things both with and without knock.wav recently?  the model seems to be taking care of case resonance quite well now, so i wonder about the continued utility of using this IR for the purpose...?  but perhaps under your custom setup it's indeed an added benefit? 

cheers,
dj

Matthieu 7:6

Re: Problem loading true stereo Impulse Responses

You know, I agree.  Perhaps this is why I haven't bothered to use knock.wav lately.  DJ, you've correct about 6.4 covering 'case resonance' where it did not exist to this character before.

- David