Topic: Small (and stupid) questions

1. What mean blinking pedal in Pianoteq (when changing models)?

2. Why "D4", not "Steinway Model D"? Why "YC5", not "Yamana C5".

3. What mean "K" in "K2"?

4. Why there is no Pro trial?

P. S. You can free use the theme for your small (and maybe stupid) questions, that is too small (and maybe too stupid) to create a separate topic for it.

Last edited by Ross (09-12-2014 20:21)
Combine velocity curves: http://output.jsbin.com/cukeme/9

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

2. International copyright law.

4. I would think that the current trial is enough to evaluate the sound and operation. Pro adds specific power-user features, and maintaining multiple trials has to be hard.

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

1. That means that the pedal changed functionality. Right-click it to see.

3. Does it really matter?

4. I'm sure Modartt has their reasons.

Hard work and guts!

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

What mean number like 415, 392 in historic pianos's preets?

Combine velocity curves: http://output.jsbin.com/cukeme/9

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Ross wrote:

What mean number like 415, 392 in historic pianos's preets?

It is standard diapason. The frequency of A note: A = 415 Hz or A= 392 Hz.

Last edited by Kridlatec (24-12-2014 20:12)
Pianoteq 6 Pro (D4, K2, Blüthner, Model B, Grotrian, Ant.Petrof)
Studiologic SL88Grand, Steinberg UR22mkII

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Kridlatec, thank you.

Another question: Is it possible to add wall for a grand piano, not only U4?

Last edited by Ross (31-12-2014 09:38)
Combine velocity curves: http://output.jsbin.com/cukeme/9

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

I never play on real grand, so I'm interesting how Pianoteq's dynamics (usually about 30-40 dB) compared to acoustic piano? What is typical dynamic range of acoustic piano. I guess that it's much greater than 40 dB, so is it hard to play on acoustic piano in right dynamics (for example, if I set 80 dB in Pianoteq, it's pretty hard to play)?

Last edited by Ross (25-01-2015 11:05)
Combine velocity curves: http://output.jsbin.com/cukeme/9

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

You can find some details on dynamics of an acoustic grand in this thread: http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/viewtopic.php?id=3149, and in particular in this paper: http://www.google.fr/url?sa=t&rct=j...8958,d.d2k.

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Why does the EQ start at 60Hz, while A0's frequency is 27,5Hz (ideal)?

Pianoteq Pro - Bechstein - Blüthner - Grotrian - K2 - Kremsegg 1 & 2 - Petrof - Steingraeber - Steinway B & D - YC5
Kawai CL35 & MP11

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

marcos daniel wrote:

Why does the EQ start at 60Hz, while A0's frequency is 27,5Hz (ideal)?

This was an arbitrary choice, thinking that one control point at 60 Hz was enough for controlling the range [20 kHz, 60 kHz]. Note that in Pianoteq PRO, using the Spectrum Profile Note Edit, you can control all individual partials for each note, including of course those which are below 60 Hz.

EDIT (27/01): of course I meant  the range [20 Hz, 60 Hz]

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Philippe Guillaume wrote:
marcos daniel wrote:

Why does the EQ start at 60Hz, while A0's frequency is 27,5Hz (ideal)?

This was an arbitrary choice, thinking that one control point at 60 Hz was enough for controlling the range [20 kHz, 60 kHz]. Note that in Pianoteq PRO, using the Spectrum Profile Note Edit, you can control all individual partials for each note, including of course those which are below 60 Hz.

So any video that explains ALL the PRO version features?

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

SteveKK wrote:

So any video that explains ALL the PRO version features?

There's the video on the Pianoteq Pro page, but the differences between Pro and Standard are really just the per-note editing and the 192kHz sample rate.

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Currently I'm learning and playing mic configuration in Pianoteq. I've read mic section in the official manual and google for other manuals and references for piano recording. And the first thing that I notices is that most of source I read in internet place mics right above strings, under lid (for example just google "piano mic placement" for images). But most presets in Pianoteq place mic at the right side of the piano.

I tried some placements (AB, XY) but with mic between strings and lid, and it's sounds ugly (but maybe it's just my fault).

Can anybody explain it? And can anybody recommend good source for mic techniques for piano recording?

Combine velocity curves: http://output.jsbin.com/cukeme/9

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Ross wrote:

Currently I'm learning and playing mic configuration in Pianoteq. I've read mic section in the official manual and google for other manuals and references for piano recording. And the first thing that I notices is that most of source I read in internet place mics right above strings, under lid (for example just google "piano mic placement" for images). But most presets in Pianoteq place mic at the right side of the piano.

I tried some placements (AB, XY) but with mic between strings and lid, and it's sounds ugly (but maybe it's just my fault).

Can anybody explain it? And can anybody recommend good source for mic techniques for piano recording?

I've experienced the same and haven't achieved satisfying results replicating popular mic placements.

formerly known as Notyetconvinced

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

This kind of mic placement is not adequate for a "classical" piano sound, usually, for classical music, mics are placed far away from the piano (2 to 3 m or even further is what I'm often using). The idea is to place the mics at the best listening place. When you place mics inside the piano you have to make a lot of EQ and compression to get a decent sound. That's what is mostly used for rock music (sometimes for jazz too). But without this processing, the sound is ugly indeed. Put your head inside a piano, you'll see (or hear!) what I mean !!!

BTW: Google is not always reliable...

Last edited by Luc Henrion (10-02-2015 09:29)

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Ross wrote:

Currently I'm learning and playing mic configuration in Pianoteq. I've read mic section in the official manual and google for other manuals and references for piano recording. And the first thing that I notices is that most of source I read in internet place mics right above strings, under lid (for example just google "piano mic placement" for images). But most presets in Pianoteq place mic at the right side of the piano.

I tried some placements (AB, XY) but with mic between strings and lid, and it's sounds ugly (but maybe it's just my fault).

Can anybody explain it? And can anybody recommend good source for mic techniques for piano recording?

There is not a golden rule for solo piano recordings but just trends. Usually for classical recordings engineers go for a spaced AB (something like 9 foot away) and sometimes even ORTF or they can even mix different perspectives. They're often "ambient" recordings meaning you do hear a lot of reverb and how the sound evolves in the room/studio/hall. To achieve that the mics must be placed outside the piano (not inside) giving an audience perspective. Nobody can say exactly "where" because it is up to you to find a sweet spot where to place the mics pair so that the different registers of the piano sound balanced. Experimenting as usual is the key, there is no way around...
A good place to start is the workshop in the D4 page which give you the basics of the different parameters and how to achieve different piano sounds. Then you can just choose a recording you like and try to do the same.

To further expand your knowledge you might also want to check a few articles on the subject. For example some microphone makers even suggest how to use their mics:
http://www.dpamicrophones.com/en/Mic-Un...Piano.aspx
http://www.royerlabs.com/rectips_piano.html
This one is a comprehensive article that gives you the possibilities to listen to different perspectives:
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jan08/a...g_0108.htm

I remember there were also other links posted in the forum about this topic so you might want to do a research here as well.

Last edited by Chopin87 (10-02-2015 13:44)
"And live to be the show and gaze o' the time."  (William Shakespeare)

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Why "reset" detuning is not flat?

http://i.imgur.com/GOFLN2H.png

Combine velocity curves: http://output.jsbin.com/cukeme/9

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Ross wrote:

Why "reset" detuning is not flat?

http://i.imgur.com/GOFLN2H.png

I think it is what we call "stretching".
Habitually on the piano, the high notes are higher and the low ones are lower than the standard equal value

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

stamkorg wrote:

I think it is what we call "stretching".

No, it's doesn't depend on "streching" setting.

Last edited by Ross (09-03-2015 19:08)
Combine velocity curves: http://output.jsbin.com/cukeme/9

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Ross wrote:

Why "reset" detuning is not flat?

http://i.imgur.com/GOFLN2H.png

?

formerly known as Notyetconvinced

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Hmm.. nobody know?

Combine velocity curves: http://output.jsbin.com/cukeme/9

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Reset returns the settings to those of the current preset. Each preset will have various edits made to single elements such as the tuning.

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

You can notice that almost all presets has the same "reset" detining. Even if I choose "flat" temperament, the curve is unchanged.

Anyway, why lower noted has negative detuning?

Last edited by Ross (09-03-2015 17:36)
Combine velocity curves: http://output.jsbin.com/cukeme/9

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Ross wrote:

Anyway, why lower noted has negative detuning?

As you may know, octaves are normally stretched down on low frequencies and up in high frequencies for the standard equal tempered tuning, see for instance the curve at the bottom of this text:

http://www.precisionstrobe.com/apps/pia...emper.html

Philippe probably thought that the standard pianoteq ET stretching for the lowest octave was not quite enough for D4 and corrected it slightly.

Last edited by Gilles (09-03-2015 18:11)

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Another question.

Why piano length in the mic section don't depend on string length parameter? Does this mean that actually the size of the virtual piano is always fixed, but only inharmonicity of string is changed by the "string length" parameter?

Combine velocity curves: http://output.jsbin.com/cukeme/9

Re: Small (and stupid) questions

Ross wrote:

Another question.

Why piano length in the mic section don't depend on string length parameter? Does this mean that actually the size of the virtual piano is always fixed, but only inharmonicity of string is changed by the "string length" parameter?

That's correct.