Topic: About your OS family
Which OS family do you use when you play Pianoteq?
If you use several OS, say which you prefer...
Which OS family do you use when you play Pianoteq?
If you use several OS, say which you prefer...
My main OS on desktop always was Linux, but when I started practice piano, Linux music software (DAW, VSTs and related soft) very disappointment me: almost all are primitive, buggy and absolutely uncomfortable to use. So, after month of using standalone Pianoteq on Linux, I decided to buy cheap laptop with Windows specifically for music practice: install Pianoteq, Reaper, VSTs and now have fun.
Why Windows, not Mac? Price.
My main OS on desktop always was Linux, but when I started practice piano, Linux music software (DAW, VSTs and related soft) very disappointment me: almost all are primitive, buggy and absolutely uncomfortable to use. So, after month of using standalone Pianoteq on Linux, I decided to buy cheap laptop with Windows specifically for music practice: install Pianoteq, Reaper, VSTs and now have fun.
Why Windows, not Mac? Price.
Ross, indeed Linux is poor for music but I can live with it if my aim is just to play Pianoteq and to do some basic audio treatment.
In my case, I went from Windows to Linux because I had dropouts on windows. It was a major problem that I couldn't fix... With the same pc and the same soundcard, no dropouts with my current Tango Studio distrib.
I am thinking to go back to Windows for all the VST...
But, are you 100% stable without dropouts on Windows?
Windows (8.1) works fine. Using music software in Linux I had much more troubles and spent many time to solve it (even considering the fact that I work almost exclusively on Linux about 15 years).
Also, for Windows there are many great VST (instruments and effects), for Linux -- only toys basically. Pianoteq works fine both in Windows and Linux, but for Linux I used only standalone version.
Win XP and Win7/64. Both are just fine, obviously the Win XP setup has (a bit) more latency because it's an older machine but it's still very stable & usable.
I have been using Ubuntu and KXStudio. I got irritated with virus scans, updates and other things needed in Windows, which interefered with piano playing, resulting in sound dropouts or poor performance. I had a learning curve, but I am glad I did it and it works well for me now. I find my setup to be very stable and a sound drop out is extremely rare, so I am satisfied with this approach.
If Pianoteq is the only sound application you need to run, Linux is very nice. Just choose the direct ALSA hardware option and voila -- no need to deal with drivers + ASIO. I even have a 4GB USB flash drive which boots up Linux + Pianoteq so I can carry this around, plug into any X86 machine and have my piano configs up within 30 seconds.
But if you do stuff beyond just playing/recording, there's certainly more commercial audio programs available on Windows. And if that means you need a faster computer to deal with all that comes with Windows, you do what's you gotta do.
My three allowed licenses are used on three different macs: my main MacPro tower, a mac mini (for taking it on the road) and an iMac.
Sadly, I also abandoned Linux, for Mac in my case, because using audio on Linux felt like death by a thousand cuts -- a lot of little problems, and the software that existed either felt flawed, or, to know it well, it seemed to be better to learn standard commercial software first. And I was short of time.
With Linux I'd recommend using an audio-oriented distro like kxstudio or avlinux (see
http://libremusicproduction.com/article...stribution) which are optimized for pro audio work, and come with a large amount of audio software.
Linux all the way for me. Mac's are too expensive (but nice machines) and windows is just beyond my patience.
I've been using Linux slackware since the mid 90's, and still use it for my server/router/gateway/accesspoint machine, but now use ubuntu studio on my desktop and my laptop, quite happy with it.
Yeah, the lack of good VST's is kind of a bummer for linux users, but when you know how to use a powerful sequencer like Renoise, even a bunch of crappy samples can make some good music. Pianoteq is pretty much the only vst/dssi/au/ladspa/etc. plugin that i (seriously) use.
Windows 7 here. Never had a single problem!
I was quite familiar with Unix (and Silicon Graphics Irix) systems back in the 1990s, so I dabbled with Linux for a few years on my PC, but I just couldn't be arsed with the beta-ware open source software it meant, and the alpha-ware (or vapour-ware) drivers.... in the end I just gave up.
Since Windows XP, Windows have been a great stable platform for audio (capable of low latency and full of killer applications). Windows 7, 8 and 8.1 have been even better (a few GUI niggles aside in 8, which they soon sorted in 8.1)
Like feline1, I worked a lot with Unix workstations (Sun and Silicon Graphics) in the 90's, but later on, our research center moved towards Windows PCs, so I had to use those also, but never found the same stability and versatility impression. So when I started with pianoteq, it was on an XP home-built machine that worked very well for audio, until it was getting to slow.
I didn't like where Microsoft was going with its OS, so I decided instead to upgrade to OSX on a Mac Pro. Absolute bliss! Everything works flawlessly, and I have my beloved, stable (not like Linux...) Unix underneath that I can tweak to my heart's content if I need to, which I did...
I installed my few absolutely necessary Windows applications in a virtual machine (VMWare Fusion) and so I have everything I need. My existing XP installation is also much faster as a virtual machine on the Mac than it was on the older hardware! But of course, I keep it away from the web...
W7 is far better than XP ever was, though.
Mac mini here, core i5, 8 gb ram, os x Yosemite. No problems. Working error-free. Mac for nine years now, so userfriendly. Perfect with Pianoteq.
I use a Laptop with Ubuntu Studio exclusively for Pianoteq.
If Pianoteq is the only sound application you need to run, Linux is very nice. Just choose the direct ALSA hardware option and voila -- no need to deal with drivers + ASIO. I even have a 4GB USB flash drive which boots up Linux + Pianoteq so I can carry this around, plug into any X86 machine and have my piano configs up within 30 seconds.
But if you do stuff beyond just playing/recording, there's certainly more commercial audio programs available on Windows. And if that means you need a faster computer to deal with all that comes with Windows, you do what's you gotta do.
Could this use be a licence terms violation?
It was mostly done as an experiment. I had a laptop where the SATA controller was broken so the only way I could use it to run off a USB flash disk. It's not like I have to play at like 15 different venues with a DP needing Pianoteq.
I've been following Pianoteq since V2.x using Windows (XP, 7 and now 8) and never experienced any problems with the native client (I only use it for live playing). Shure, Windows are degenerative OSs and they need a lot of maintenance care (cleaning temporary files, defragmenting disks, fixing registry issues, etc.), but I have to say that it has been a joy to use Pianoteq.
The interface reigns supreme to everything else that I know of, and I believe that the experience using the native client in Linux, Windows or MacOS should be the same (again kudos for Modartt!!).
Due to my interest in open source OSs, I intend to try it under BSD... perhaps this summer I'll have a go!
For those complaining about vst implementation on Linux, apparently, there are good news:
http://breakfastquay.com/dssi-vst/
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic...p;t=414077
https://github.com/abique/vst-bridge
http://www.linux-vst.com/
Cheers!
Shure, Windows are degenerative OSs and needs a lot of maintenance care (cleaning temporary files, defragmenting disks, fixing registry issues, etc.)
Temporary files are there on any OS, even Linux, even OSX. Of course they need cleaning from time to time.
Defragmenting is also something that needs to be done on any OS (yes, even OSX, even Linux), because it's a fact that hard drives are chaotic devices, and there's nothing one can do to prevent fragmentation, really. One solution is using only solid state drives, which have extremely fast seek times, so fragmentation becomes a non-issue.
As for registry issues - I never had them in 10 years of using Windows, back in XP times. That's a pure fallacy.
As for registry issues - I never had them in 10 years of using Windows, back in XP times. That's a pure fallacy.
That depends on what and how often do you install applications on your PC. I have experienced some gruesome issues with Windows XP registry that required to recover it from backups.
Linux, depending on the chosen file system and configuration, is not affected by disk fragmentation.
Man, if you have a 10 year Windows rig and never performed any maintenance...
I've had a well-tuned XP system for 7 years, and for past 3 years I'm on Windows 7 (on a newer computer, i5 quadcore), hardly any maintenance (apart from regular monthly sweep with CCleaner, which is always a good thing), over a 100 of programs installed, tons of sample libraries, and it's still running smooth and without a single issue. I don't remember when I had to fix something with the registry (probably early in XP times, but even then it wasn't much). It's just running fine! So don't know what you're talking about.
Linux, depending on the chosen file system and configuration, is not affected by disk fragmentation.
Sure is, just depends WHEN it happens. On Linux, the fuller your hard drive is, the more prone to fragmentation it becomes (and also, some usage patterns are prone to fragmenting the filesystem sooner rather than later).
In Linux, with regular ext4, you need to defrag only if you have >=85-90% of used disk space and by then you should buy a new disk.... unfortunately, not the same for windows.
I should mention that my experience with windows 8 has been stellar, but then again, I have a good rig (i7-3635QM, 12GB RAM, 1TB SSD)
I don't have a problem in running a defrag once a month, really. But ultimately, SSD is the final solution - then no matter which filesystem you have, you really don't have to care about fragmentation (yeah, 1 TB SSD is quite cool - if a bit expensive at the moment. I'm still waiting for the prices to fall more.)
(Also, with ext4, I'm reading that fragmentation becomes much more possible when you reach less than 20% free space on it - not 10-15%.)
I got to tell you, installing the SSD was truly the best upgrade that I have ever made. The difference in performance is stunning! (specially if you also use sampled libraries)
Regarding the ext4, in my experience, I only noticed some degradation when I had my disk 92% full.
Indeed!
The difference in performance is stunning! (specially if you also use sampled libraries)
Is this true also for the use of Pianoteq?
Hi stamkorg,
For Pianoteq is rather irrelevant.
As you probably know, Pianoteq is a 4th gen software, meaning, it generates the sound on the fly, through complex mathematical formulas. So, does its magic, occupying only some 40MB (yes, megabytes!!) of hard disk... The CPU clock is much more important!
For me, I admit, I'm spoiled, because I only have to wait a few seconds from pressing the start button of my laptop (from a shutdown state) to be using Pianoteq with my favorite addon (Blüthner).
Hello,
Thank you,
That's what a thought.
Hi, I've just finished my session with my band... for this occasion I've played pianoteq pro in my brand new Surface pro 3 (quad core i5 with 4GB of ram and 128 mb hard disk).
It runs Windows 8.1 and I've to admit to be a little disappointed with this experience...
In the option menu under CPU performance I've noticed a high use of processors.. with a value of 15 in the "performance index" field with occasional drop-out of cpu and horrible laks of audio signal..
I've used Pianoteq pro in two ways..
1) the first preset of D4 played via midi using a Kore control with a buffer of 256 and a modest 32 notes of poliphony at 44.100 Hz of sampling rate...after few minutes I've selected a value of 512 for the buffer having only a minimum improvement (????)
2) the same preset loading Pianoteq pro into Native instruments KORE host ... in this case a pop up message occasionally shows (your CPU i5 is not sufficent for computing... or some similar) (What??????)..
I'm very worried about... any suggestion???
Normally I play pianoteq in a i7core with a old Windows vista 64 bit without any kind of problem... It's realli Pianopteq so hungry ????
I apologize for my english....
Keyrunner
I have a quadcore i5 and Pianoteq runs just fine!
Same here, i5 on both a desktop and a laptop. Not a single problem. You should (as I mentioned somewhere else) download "latencymon" and check possible issues. It's here:
http://www.resplendence.com/latencymon
You could also have a look at "dpc latency checker", it's here:
http://www.thesycon.de/deu/latency_check.shtml
Both are 100% great freewares. Go for it.
The same for me,
I run Pianoteq on a 2-core I5 2,53Ghz with 4Gb of RAM, at 48Khz and 64 samples on the buffer, max polyphony to 128 without any dropout. The performance index is between 35-42.
My OS is Tango Studio.
Hi guys,
first of all I would like to wish you all a Happy Easter.
I would also like to thank you for your interest for my problem. As you advised me I downloaded "LatencyMon" and I made the test whith disappointing results as you can see from the report below.
So I followed some pieces of advice suggested by the App, such as switching off the antivirus and defining some parameters for the energetic saving.
Further more I left the tablet connected to its power supply in order to guarantee a constant voltage to the audio card, connected by USB socket.
In this way I've got coniderable improvements.
Now I can play Pianoteq Pro in stand-alone with a 30 cpu performance index value without apparent lacks of audio signals; this with 96 notes of poliphony, 44.1 Hz of sampling rate and 128 for the buffer size with minimum of latency.
I'm a little less worried and I'll keep perfectioning the settings, expecially in order to use KORE, where I'm running other Vst instrumemts to add some pads when it is necessary.
Hopefully the developers keep their focus on the Cpu computing consume in the next Pianoteq Upgrades.
For the moment...... finger crossed!!!! Ciao!!!
Here the test result....
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CONCLUSION
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Your system appears to be having trouble handling real-time audio and other tasks. You are likely to experience buffer underruns appearing as drop outs, clicks or pops. One or more DPC routines that belong to a driver running in your system appear to be executing for too long. At least one detected problem appears to be network related. In case you are using a WLAN adapter, try disabling it to get better results. One problem may be related to power management, disable CPU throttling settings in Control Panel and BIOS setup. Check for BIOS updates.
LatencyMon has been analyzing your system for 0:05:00 (h:mm:ss) on all processors.
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
SYSTEM INFORMATION
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Computer name: ANTONIO
OS version: Windows 8 , 6.2, build: 9200 (x64)
Hardware: OEMC
CPU: GenuineIntel Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-4300U CPU @ 1.90GHz
Logical processors: 4
Processor groups: 1
RAM: 4001 MB total
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU SPEED
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Reported CPU speed: 2494,0 MHz
Measured CPU speed: 91,0 MHz (approx.)
Note: reported execution times may be calculated based on a fixed reported CPU speed. Disable variable speed settings like Intel Speed Step and AMD Cool N Quiet in the BIOS setup for more accurate results.
WARNING: the CPU speed that was measured is only a fraction of the CPU speed reported. Your CPUs may be throttled back due to variable speed settings and thermal issues. It is suggested that you run a utility which reports your actual CPU frequency and temperature.
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
MEASURED INTERRUPT TO USER PROCESS LATENCIES
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The interrupt to process latency reflects the measured interval that a usermode process needed to respond to a hardware request from the moment the interrupt service routine started execution. This includes the scheduling and execution of a DPC routine, the signaling of an event and the waking up of a usermode thread from an idle wait state in response to that event.
Highest measured interrupt to process latency (µs): 4916,317906
Average measured interrupt to process latency (µs): 21,581025
Highest measured interrupt to DPC latency (µs): 849,014232
Average measured interrupt to DPC latency (µs): 3,179462
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
REPORTED ISRs
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Interrupt service routines are routines installed by the OS and device drivers that execute in response to a hardware interrupt signal.
Highest ISR routine execution time (µs): 61,888532
Driver with highest ISR routine execution time: storport.sys - Microsoft Storage Port Driver, Microsoft Corporation
Highest reported total ISR routine time (%): 0,007253
Driver with highest ISR total time: storport.sys - Microsoft Storage Port Driver, Microsoft Corporation
Total time spent in ISRs (%) 0,012477
ISR count (execution time <250 µs): 20895
ISR count (execution time 250-500 µs): 0
ISR count (execution time 500-999 µs): 0
ISR count (execution time 1000-1999 µs): 0
ISR count (execution time 2000-3999 µs): 0
ISR count (execution time >=4000 µs): 0
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
REPORTED DPCs
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
DPC routines are part of the interrupt servicing dispatch mechanism and disable the possibility for a process to utilize the CPU while it is interrupted until the DPC has finished execution.
Highest DPC routine execution time (µs): 2926,293103
Driver with highest DPC routine execution time: ACPI.sys - Driver ACPI per NT, Microsoft Corporation
Highest reported total DPC routine time (%): 0,043396
Driver with highest DPC total execution time: Wdf01000.sys - Runtime framework driver modalità kernel, Microsoft Corporation
Total time spent in DPCs (%) 0,165369
DPC count (execution time <250 µs): 203949
DPC count (execution time 250-500 µs): 0
DPC count (execution time 500-999 µs): 106
DPC count (execution time 1000-1999 µs): 1
DPC count (execution time 2000-3999 µs): 2
DPC count (execution time >=4000 µs): 0
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
REPORTED HARD PAGEFAULTS
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Hard pagefaults are events that get triggered by making use of virtual memory that is not resident in RAM but backed by a memory mapped file on disk. The process of resolving the hard pagefault requires reading in the memory from disk while the process is interrupted and blocked from execution.
NOTE: some processes were hit by hard pagefaults. If these were programs producing audio, they are likely to interrupt the audio stream resulting in dropouts, clicks and pops. Check the Processes tab to see which programs were hit.
Process with highest pagefault count: avastsvc.exe
Total number of hard pagefaults 581
Hard pagefault count of hardest hit process: 367
Highest hard pagefault resolution time (µs): 6174,004010
Total time spent in hard pagefaults (%): 0,029233
Number of processes hit: 12
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
PER CPU DATA
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 0 Interrupt cycle time (s): 1,510462
CPU 0 ISR highest execution time (µs): 61,888532
CPU 0 ISR total execution time (s): 0,016703
CPU 0 ISR count: 2121
CPU 0 DPC highest execution time (µs): 1512,810746
CPU 0 DPC total execution time (s): 0,613882
CPU 0 DPC count: 120542
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 1 Interrupt cycle time (s): 2,280258
CPU 1 ISR highest execution time (µs): 49,528869
CPU 1 ISR total execution time (s): 0,113324
CPU 1 ISR count: 15977
CPU 1 DPC highest execution time (µs): 2926,293103
CPU 1 DPC total execution time (s): 0,773841
CPU 1 DPC count: 43094
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 2 Interrupt cycle time (s): 1,369872
CPU 2 ISR highest execution time (µs): 50,781877
CPU 2 ISR total execution time (s): 0,007182
CPU 2 ISR count: 1102
CPU 2 DPC highest execution time (µs): 550,746993
CPU 2 DPC total execution time (s): 0,365866
CPU 2 DPC count: 22966
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 3 Interrupt cycle time (s): 0,882676
CPU 3 ISR highest execution time (µs): 49,091820
CPU 3 ISR total execution time (s): 0,012538
CPU 3 ISR count: 1695
CPU 3 DPC highest execution time (µs): 2869,675221
CPU 3 DPC total execution time (s): 0,231156
CPU 3 DPC count: 17456
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Also, make sure your Power Options are set to High Performance instead of Balanced or Eco.
Ok, thank you for the info.. Windows 8.1 Pro is new for me... until now I was on a old Vista OS..
A question.. If possibile to set different "Power Option".. based on the running program?
Ciao
keyrunner
Not that I know of. You should do it before your performance/practice, then switch it back to normal when not using Pianoteq.
A question.. If possibile to set different "Power Option".. based on the running program?
Maybe you can try to create different sessions with a different power option for each one
Hi Keyrunner,
I think that Evildragon has just hit the spot: Windows Power Plans.
I have an i7 CPU and had initial problems similar to yours... it was driving me crazy!
Solved it by creating a power plan just to make shure that my CPU didn't throttled down.
In the command line (cmd), one could use the "powercfg" utility. You could use "powercfg /L" to list the current configured powerplans, then you could create a shortcut with something like "powercfg /S xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx" replacing the x's with the correspondent key of the powerplan to set it and "voilà"! (in the shortcut properties, you could configure a "hot key" that you can use to change your current power plan).
Hope this helps.
Wow! Thanks a lot guys,
I,ve to learn a Little bit with Windows features..
In the next days I'll made some test.. thanks again!!!!