Topic by howardS

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Topic: Combining velocity curves

I really like that we can set up velocity curves for our various keyboards. We can see of course that various presets have velocity curves programmed into them so it seems to me that I would want to somehow include these dynamics when loading the curve for my various keyboards. Let me explain what I mean by giving an example. If I load the D4 Classical Piano BA patch and then set the velocity to match the velocity preset I created for my RD700nx then the velocity is changed accordingly. It goes from that straight 45 degree angle line to my RD700nx velocity curve. If however I select the D4 Blues patch I see that its curve is not flat. It seems to me that part of the dynamics of that patch as originally written by the person who made the patch should include some of the detailing from that velocity curve and that I would lose that if I just use my RD700nx velocity curve. It seems to me that the correct thing would be for the program to calculate the variances in the curve of the D4 Bles and somehow apply that to my RD700nx velocity curve. Is there any way to do that within Pianoteq?

Reply by EvilDragon

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Re: Combining velocity curves

You can freeze parameters, including velocity curves, so that it doesn't change when you load a different patch.

Hard work and guts!

Reply by robsogge

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Re: Combining velocity curves

the way I understand the question is:

certain presets come with their own velocity curves, which deviate from the linear response in certain ways.
Is there a way to apply those deviations not to a linear curve but to my custom one? Let's say, for example, that the preset curve has a value of 70 at velocity 64, with a deviation of 6 from the linear response. My custom curve has a value at vel 64 of 60, can I apply that deviation to my curve so to get, at vel 64, a value of 66? And so on for every point of the curve...
But maybe I'm misunderstanding...
Anyway I don't think that that's possible

Last edited by robsogge (27-11-2014 15:31)

Reply by howardS

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Re: Combining velocity curves

That is exactly my question, robsogge. It is not just a matter of freezing the parameter as EvilDragon suggested. I know about that function and use it but noticed that I lose those deviations as you called it, robsogge. I also don't think it is possible in the current software so I guess I would ask if this can be added as a feature request.

Reply by EvilDragon

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Re: Combining velocity curves

I don't think you can do that without summing the curves manually in a different program, then putting them back in.

Hard work and guts!

Reply by howardS

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Re: Combining velocity curves

Thanks, EvilDragon. I didn't see that option either but would definitely use it. There are some gigs where I use a few different patches and it would be good to be able to tune or calibrate the keybed and create a velocity curve for that keyboard which could then be combined with the deviations of the various velocity curves of those patches. Obviously it just takes too long to do the math on the various patch manually.

Reply by Gilles

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Re: Combining velocity curves

Velocity curves have two uses, adapting to the keyboard's response and also as a sort of equalizer/compressor.

That's why you see curves in presets, where of course the idea is that the keyboard playing it has a perfect linear response.

What you ask is perfectly legitimate, and I would favor adding such a simple curve addition tool to the Velocity Curve Section in the forum. This way, you could produce the finished curves you want and store them in a mini-preset.

Reply by howardS

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Re: Combining velocity curves

That could help in some situations, Gill although of course it would be even better if the calculations were just done in the software.  It could be a suboption of the freeze of the velocity curve where you could perhaps freeze and combine with preset.

Reply by geert

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Re: Combining velocity curves

This is indeed a welcome addition for the future!

I changed to VPC-1, and it can remember its own curves. That does the trick. Also, to have most of the adaptation in side your keyboard, has the advantage, that Midi files from internet play without the - in this case unwanted - keyboard velocity adaptations.

greetings,

Geert

Reply by GRB

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Re: Combining velocity curves

Not really knowing much at all about Pianoteq settings, it seems to me that at least in the Pro Version, an end user has always needed the ability to save all parameters to a preset which can be called up quickly by the Controller Keyboard, or master Tablet on the Music Desk which controls it all.  The point is presets are essential.  Tweaking is no good unless you can easily recall it again in the future.

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Reply by howardS

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Re: Combining velocity curves

I have the Stage version, GRB, and see that you can definitely save edited presets. Separate from that it seems that you can assign a midi event which will call up the preset. You do that through the Preset Manager. You can get there through the Window tab or by hitting L on your keyboard.

Reply by howardS

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Re: Combining velocity curves

Hi Gille,

I saw your reference to this thread over here: http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/viewtopic.php?id=3740

I don't think Pianoteq responded to this request and in the interim have thought about using something like MIDI Shape Shifter. I have played with it a bit and it definitely takes some overhead but it allows you to take incoming MIDI information coming into your DAW and then have that go to a virtual MIDI port or device which you would then send to PianoTeq. The benefit of that program of course is that my other plugins such as Lounge Lizard get the benefit of having custom velocity settings. You may also want to have a look at it. Here is a link:

https://code.google.com/p/midi-shape-shifter/

I don't think it will work if you want to run Pianoteq in standalone mode so you would need to run it from inside a DAW.

Howard

Reply by Ross

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Re: Combining velocity curves

I've written a simple tool for combining curves: link. In Pianoteq use ctrl-c/ctrl-v or menu items to copy/paste velocity curves.

The output is not "sum" of curves as EvilDragon called it. Actually, if first curve represents map f, second map g, then output curve is a representation of the composition map f∘g.

It's maybe buggy, I'm not a programmer. I also don't have my own site, so I just googled the first free hosting for debugging JS and posted my code there. I'm not sure about how long the link will be active. I guess always.

Last edited by Ross (08-01-2015 13:46)
Combine velocity curves: http://output.jsbin.com/cukeme/9

Reply by howardS

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Re: Combining velocity curves

Thanks, Ross. With some planning and organization you can have your favourite patches combined with several keybed types available. Cool.

Reply by Gilles

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Re: Combining velocity curves

You're right Ross, this if function composition and not addition. I tried a couple of cases and your tool seems to work very well!

A bit annoying to have to edit out the prefix "Velocity =" but that's nothing really.

Reply by Ross

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Re: Combining velocity curves

Gilles wrote:

A bit annoying to have to edit out the prefix "Velocity =" but that's nothing really.

OK, I fixed it.

Combine velocity curves: http://output.jsbin.com/cukeme/9

Reply by davidizquierdo82

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Re: Combining velocity curves

umm very interesting, I'm facing the same problem here and thanks a lot Ross for that tool which made the problem easier but still a bit of hassle having to edit curves and saving new presets for those affected instruments patches in PTQ...

Would be great if Moddart listened to this issue which - I guess more people are having as well - and created a kind of integrated tool or function to fix it.

Thanks to all and good night

EDIT: Apossibe solution could be a "two steps velocity curve", one velocity curve which is the assigned to the controller (assuming a 45º straight velocity on the patch) and the other curve which is the assigned to the instrument patch (initially assigned by Moddart, but maybe eventually also editable by user?), the resulting curve should be the automatic addition of both.. ahhh how beautiful is daydreaming

Last edited by davidizquierdo82 (20-02-2015 17:23)
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