VPC1 Review (Page 1 of 2)

Is that lighter, heavier or the same as other Kawai models from 2 years ago to today in terms of touch?

...to continue...

Built like a tank, and almost as heavy ; )  , the quality of thd VPC1 is very, very high.
The wooden end cheeks are beautifully finished and gives the feel of being at a grand piano (albeit with a little imagination!) The only thing I would say on the quality control side of things is that the spray finish on the aluminium top, although being acceptable, does not quite live up to the standard of the end cheeks. That said, I am in thd process of building up a shine to the paint finish using a vinyl/rubber care polish (British made 'Auto Glym', so there are ways around this and it is only asthetics, but still, it would have been nice to have had the same quality finish on the top as on the ends.

PianoTEQ's CUSTOM CURVE
-------------------------------

As you might expect, the custom curve works a treat. You have at your disposal a vast palette of colours to enjoy and, should you have a good set of monitors and/or headphones, you will be able to appreciate this.
I did try creating my own curve with the learn function, but I was not impressed! Stick to the inbuilt and authorised/approved one.

USB Cable INCLUDED!
-------------------------

A USB cable is included as standard, and this high quality cable even comes with god plated connections!

Thank you Kawai!

Software
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I have downloaded the editor software, but haven't needed to use it. Besides, I've done enough "tweaking" to last a lifetime! The beauty of the VPC1 is that I can now just concentrate on playing rather than tweaking because, as I have intimated, the board is pretty much ready to go "Out-of-the-Box".

In Conclusion
---------------

Overall, I am extremely happy with this "piano". Any minor niggles are just that, minor. The price (£1099 Promenade Music UK) is very, very reasonable, especially when you compare to other well known makes. I WOULD recommend this board as a serious piano controller and look forward to many happy years with it!

Kindest Regards,

Chris

Here's a link to Kawai's pic of the VPC1 action -

RM3_Grand_II.

I've tried to see in it some mechanical equivalent to the grand piano Check catch, which interrupts the complete fallback of the hammerthrow-action as long as the key stays somewhat depressed, and makes the repetition available - on grands. Because with the action set at this partly-fired position, less finger action is needed to repeat a note than if the action starts from key-at-rest position.

But I can't see any - unless that small black rectangle (possibly felt) just shy of the balance-pins is it?

Else, I figure if any improvement to repetition which can result from the intermediate third sensor is present, the fingers must find and maintain the required level for repetition themselves, without any security coming from a Check. Tricky but imaginable.

Another possibility occurs to me, that if Kawai has opted to provide Check-ing via electronic rather than mechanical means, that could explain why Sustain makes trill more secure, and a bit of practice with LIGHT Sustain might turn the trick?

That might have occurred to the Kawai engineers as a 'natural' bright idea, since light partial pedalling makes a degree of unsustained note-sounds possible, in sound not wholly unlike the grand piano in a no-pedal but some-notes-checked state.

ADDED: here's that -

NAMM clip

- which includes (sorry, too impatient  to crop now, will do it later) the demonstrator showing both grand and VPC1 actions, and specifically describing while showing the repetition feature. It makes it clear the first explanation is correct - no check, fingers do it all. And seems to indicate they do it best with a deep touch.

Though the demonstrator hasn't got sound-feedback to guide him, on the toy he's using.

; p

The VPC1 certainly feels divine to play!!!

; p

Just this moment measured white key touch depth.
Exactly 10mm.
This is indeed relatively shallow.
Also, there is room between top of key and fall/name board felt which would allow the key to be raised incrementally at the balance point to increase the touch depth 1mm or so. This would be much more acceptable than adjusting depth at the front by removing 1mm of packing because doing this would interfere with the point of let-off which happens to be correct.
Again, I don't wish to do this myself, but it would be a very simple operation. As I have said before, I'm not sure what would be the effect on the PianoTEQ custom touch curve!

Kindest Regards,

Chris

http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/8234/imageojna.jpg

Looking more closely at this, I am now of the opinion that there is 'room enough' for up to 1mm off the key front bottom. Probably less than 1mm would suffice, which is probably where personal taste/playing style/technique comes in. But there is certainly a little room there due to the fact that there could be a little more 'drop' after let-off than has been factory set. So it does look like a simple tweak would make all the difference! I personally do like to feel that post let-off drop so for me, this would solve three issues;

1. Touch Depth
2. Third Sensor Point
3. Let-Off Drop

UK Kawai Technician?

: )

Kindest Regards,

Chris

I was referring to the amount of tonal range now available. Sorry to be so flowery!

Kindest Regards,

Chris

Thank you James. I heed your advice

Glad you like the polished finish. Not yet complete, but getting there. It's taken several days now but is well worth the patience.

Thanks again,

Kindest Regards,

Chris

James, sigasa has operated on a host of keyboards - yow such years! - and it's unreasonable he CAN stop dead in his tracks now. But he won't violate the warranty, and his chances of getting a tech to do it are tiny.

So it's thought-experiments at least for now, and who'd disallow them? They got everybody General Relativity, cost nothing, violate no warranties, and might illuminate solutions to what now looks like a go-nowhere state of play. Following his bent might get us ways to bypass a problem that's been met. We know Mozart found trills problematic, enough to have to study them specially, and the very existence of repetition speaks to the same point. It'd be not surprising if it didn't solve it completely either, on grands and all - Chopin didn't like it, maybe with good reason (like sigasa's quiet trills problem for instance).

So -

From memory, the letoff-simulator is a small flap of rubber that scrapes a slight catchpoint during key-slowed hammer descent, so the point where it shocks the key with a little 'tock' is geometrically fixed. Thus, if you have built up the balance-pin with shims, you should be able to draw a line from catchpoint thru raised balance-pin-position to keybed felt, to establish exactly the needed thinning, or reversely if you go the opposite way. (A tech might well provide scale drawings. Whether he'd have anything to offer about sensor-position seems doubtful. They seem to be concealed within a non-transparent squeezebag. Concealed. Wonder why.)

As for what tradeoff re sensor that would bring about I won't think about for now.

For a memory comes back to me, of Horowitz executing a most powerful trill, during one of the Rachmaninov slow movements, forget which just now. Not Argerich nor Lang Lang, nor Kissin (I theenk) comes even close this effect. Pussies don't even try. But perhaps such power isn't in the score (we know H was a major showoff)? fff trills; I KNOW Kissin's at least up to ff, but not this stunt (let's say) of H's!

And from memory, it was executed between thumb and third finger, with 3 lifted well off the key.

So perhaps 'The Repetition' is NOT a full solution to trills with power. Just an idea. I'll find my copy of that concerto and clip out the point in question. Might do the same with the Kissin ff trill I have in mind, which though unluckily is from behind him I seem to recall is using high-raised fingers. Back later.

This is my first post and I want to Thank You sigasa for posting your review. I am still waiting for my VPC1 as the delivery date continues to be pushed out.

I do have a deep concern about the potential sustain pedal issue. You mentioned that it "shoots out "0's" which trigger the damper noise sample like a machine gun!"

Are you saying that it re-sends several 0 values when the pedal is released? Is it continuous when the pedal is up or do you think it is just related to potential switch/pot bounce when pedal is released quickly?

I also wonder if it re-sends continuous 127 values when held fully down? This sustain problem would cause major time consuming issues for me as I would not want to have to wade through all of the unnecessary midi info to edit any pedal points in my DAW.

Have you brought this issue to Kawai yet? I wonder if it is just a defective fatar pedal unit or in need of adjustment?

I'm sorry for so many questions but this could be a serious issue for me and I would appreciate your further thoughts on the mater.

Kind regards,
Rick

For those worried about the pedal unit on the VPC1...

Please don't be. It works very well.

I have had my VPC1 since the middle of March and love it. The sustain pedal on the VPC1 is very efficient and if it's sustaining too much for you, go to the area where velocity curves are set and scroll through to the Sustain Pedal Calibration and follow the instructions. It will set your pedaling style so that it works perfectly. As far as hearing it work, just go to the Action area and you can set the amount of pedal noise you like from none to what suits your taste. The pedal action noise is not created by the pedal unit but is part of the Pianoteq parameters.

Rick, I hope this helps to ease some of your concerns.

Robert

Hi guys,
the VPC1 has arrived today!!!!!

Completely agree with Sigasa, quality is very high. and the "austere" look has impressed me!

I use a K&M 18810 stand with an optional music-score stand attached to the structure, and a led lamp.
will post a photo tomorrow.

USB quality of the cable provided is very good, but I need a 3 mt long, so I bought a Neutrik cable.

I installed the usb driver and Kawai editor.

so that the only button/led on the top of vpc1 is blinking green , indicating that you are using a Pianoteq curve preset!!!! whow!

the details, the sensibility and the shades of the ptq curve seems endless.....and compared with the Clavinova GH3 kb, I certanly need a period of practice to become familiar with the wooden keys and the particular touch.

The editor is really full of functions but I started using the standard configuration.

I had just the time to play 1 hour.

I think there now enough material/review/simple opinions  on the ptq forum to make vpc1 the preferred midi controller of the year.......
and convincing anyone willing to change/upgrade to seriously consider this new keyboard, not a cheap one, but indeed a long term investment......

Pleased to hear you're another happy VPC1 owner!

Regarding sustain pedal, any issues?

I may indeed have had a dodgy unit, but no matter as I installed the PNOscan sensors yesterday and it works now flawlessly with perfect accuracy.

I can get hold of the PNOscan TUSB unit together with sensors and necessary cables for €375 (August 2012). Pricey, but a one off payment as the whole set up works as a standalone via USB and therefore can be used with any keyboard. If anybody needs one, let me know.

Kindest Regards,

Chris

Hello Chris,

Thank you for your reply, I hope I did not hi-jack your thread too much.

It sounds like you have found a suitable solution, I am very happy for you. Also, the pictures you posted of the VPC1 top cover looks wonderful. Again, thank you for sharing this info and your personal experiences.

Kind regards,
Rick

http://youtu.be/kz43P4yTkHY

I am happy with my setup now James. I have optical sensors in the pedal housing which are extremely accurate and work beautifully. Also I am able to select which pedals I wish to operate as continuous controllers. I have set the sustain and una-corda to continuous and the sustenuto to switch.
As I say, the Fatar triple piano pedal unit supplied with the VPC1 is very solid and stable.
If anybody else has an issue, may I urge them to send a forum e-mail to James as he has requested.

http://imageshack.us/photo/photo/802/imagezokf.jpg/

It seems that the issue with my pedal was almost certainly an isolated incident as there are no other reports of such a phenomenon on the web, at least none that I've seen (and I did a lot if research into the VPC1 before taking the plunge! It's certainly not a deal breaker. The pedal's construction is very robust and if there are any other issues, present or future, they will almost certainly pop up on one or more related forums. Thd fact that they have not done so already leads me to conclude that I was just 'unlucky'. It was most probably a dirty potentiometer that caused the strange velocity behaviour in my case, but fortunately I have a workaround. And the bonus of having this workaround is that I don't have to send my pedal back but can continue to play my beautiful new instrument!

Kindest Regards,

Chris

Yesterday, I spoke to a sales rep from England Pianos in Atlanta about a different Kawai. (England Pianos is one of the few Kawai sellers in the southeast US.) He told me that in general Kawai underestimated the demand for its latest keyboards and was having trouble manufacturing them fast enough. Could be a problem anywhere down the supplier chain--one part that was back-ordered could slow down everything.

This might be good news, in a sense--Kawai keyboards in the US have been less prominent than Yamaha and Roland and just about all of the other keyboard makers. It's possible that the demand for their instruments will give us more choices. Of course, it could also mean that they fall too far behind and never recover... I prefer the more optimistic outlook.

Thomann just emailed me today to say that Kawai can't supply them with any more VPC1's until 31st July (!)

Guess I gotta stay patient.......

Oh, I never thought they'd stopped manufacturing it! After all, they were proudly showing it off at MusikMesse only a couple of months ago! They just totally underestimated consumer interest, clearly!

I guess marketing people must've told them "duh, nobody wants a pure MIDI controller with no onboard sounds and zero frills, not even a pitch bend wheel!" - but that's EXACTLY what a lot of people want: a high quality product that does one thing very well, without endless half-baked distractions.

I'd like to think that effective marketing is actually one of the reasons for the VPC1's popularity...