Topic by Jake Johnson

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  • Jake Johnson
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Topic: Uploaded Revised M3 Changed Partial Matching and audio file demo

EDIT: SEE THE POST LATER IN THIS THREAD about getting the sound of the mp3\midi file while playing the fxp. A lowest velocity setting thing that's easy to change. (Was I shouting?)

A contemporary jazz preset. Uses the default Pianoteq temperament but varies the tuning. At low velocities, it may at first seem dark,  but the upper octaves are tuned to upper formant partials from the middle (the bearing or the temperament octave, I believe it's called), so the sound is both darker and brighter than the default M3, if that makes any sense--less upper stretch, but more sympathetic resonance.

(As always, my keyboard has the damper pedal set to CC4. You may need to reset it to CC64.)

http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/uploads.p...Preset.mp3

http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/uploads.p...opy%29.fxp


Notes:

--Revised issues at middle C and the uppermost treble that I should have noticed earlier. It's 5:30 am. It sounded fine with the midi file...

--The audio file never reaches fortissimo. Be careful using other midi files with higher velocities. It can get loud.

--The Velocity curve dips to the right. That fit the midi file. For more forceful playing, you may want to straighten it out a little.

--One change in the revision that I'm not sure I like. In the first version, Impedance was set to .30 for the low bass and the upper treble. Sounded fine in the midi rendering, but the notes died a little too fast when playing the preset. Raised it up some, but that brightens the instrument a little more than I intended.

Glenn: To me, your "O Come Emmanuel" midi file sounds good with this, too. Better with the first version than the revision. Trying to find a way to give the bass and treble a longer decay without increasing the impedance as much as in the revised version. But you may have to play it just a little harder to get a similar, forceful sound.

Last edited by Jake Johnson (31-12-2009 02:06)

Reply by boehnbr

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Re: Uploaded Revised M3 Changed Partial Matching and audio file demo

Jake, that is a really nice preset.  it comes closest to an intimate jazz sound of anything i've heard on pianoteq.  good work.

it still seems to ring a little more than i would find ideal as a listener (i know, close the lid?...), but the lower registers sound really more authentic than anything else i've listened to...

it is so hard to describe this stuff.   like trying to analyze sneezing.

Reply by DonSmith

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Re: Uploaded Revised M3 Changed Partial Matching and audio file demo

When creating a new piano, a good thing to try is combining two pianos:

1. Go to the Parameters (square with tick inside) under 'Note Edit', near the word 'Random' (sorry, I can't do screen shots).
2. Tick parameters you want from the list; then close that window.
3. Choose another piano. The Piano will have the word (modified) in brackets.
4. Save as a new piano.
5. Remember to go back to the parameters panel and clear all settings, otherwise this will keep applying the settings to your pianos.

Try combining the power of the YC5s settings to the C3s and M3s, sounds good.

Reply by Jake Johnson

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Re: Uploaded Revised M3 Changed Partial Matching and audio file demo

boehnbr wrote:

Jake, that is a really nice preset.  it comes closest to an intimate jazz sound of anything i've heard on pianoteq.  good work.

it still seems to ring a little more than i would find ideal as a listener (i know, close the lid?...), but the lower registers sound really more authentic than anything else i've listened to...

it is so hard to describe this stuff.   like trying to analyze sneezing.

Thanks. To me, the ring is stronger in the revision than in the mp3. Does reducing the sympathetic resonance help? I hated having to revise (raise) the Impedance in all the ranges. I'm trying to reduce it and still get sustain on soft, un-pedaled notes. Don't know why, but the first version sustained more and sounded better playing the midi file than when I played it live. (Closing the lid doesn't seem to work.) What you may also like in the bass is that the preset kills the Unison width there and reduces its impedance and volume, while raising the volume of the middle. The tuning lowers the pitch in the bass, too.

The tuning, I think, has a lot to do with the general sound. A variation of a Bill Bremmer tuning combined with the great PianoTeq temperament. Bremmer is someone I'm still trying to understand--influenced by Jorgensen's history of tuning, he's created a modern version of the Broadwood\Victorian temperaments. Jorgensen praises and helped to revise it. BB is sometimes controversial, waging an ongoing battle against equal temperament and arguing for tuning the upper range to higher partials in the middle (temperament range) while trying to explain his temperament, which is hard to duplicate--from what I can tell, it's a well temperament that keeps the thirds almost beatless, but not just\pure. (An impure meantone? A mean well? I'm still learning about temperaments...) The two wars and the necessarily complex explanation get conflated in discussions. Essentially, this preset keeps the PianoTeq well temperament and stretch, which gets added to my reduced stretch, I think, but explores his tuning procedure. (More than you wanted to know? Sorry. Trying to reach an understanding myself as I explain.)

I'm just astonished by what PianoTeq can do.

Last edited by Jake Johnson (04-01-2010 21:46)

Reply by Glenn NK

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Re: Uploaded Revised M3 Changed Partial Matching and audio file demo

boehnbr wrote:

Jake, that is a really nice preset.  it comes closest to an intimate jazz sound of anything i've heard on pianoteq.  good work.

it still seems to ring a little more than i would find ideal as a listener (i know, close the lid?...), but the lower registers sound really more authentic than anything else i've listened to...

it is so hard to describe this stuff.   like trying to analyze sneezing.

Yes, it's nice (listening to Jake's midi with it).

"like trying to analyze sneezing" - a very good metaphor and a good chuckle - thanks.

Glenn

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Reply by Jake Johnson

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Re: Uploaded Revised M3 Changed Partial Matching and audio file demo

The midi file appears to have the lowest strike at about 23-24. (Watching the bar move around on the Velocity pane, many of the soft notes come in at around 50.)

To get the sound of the midi file\mp3 while playing the preset live:

In the Velocity pane, drag the node at the very bottom up until it's around 23-24. (Or adjust your midi keyboard until the lowest velocity you play is in that area).

THE ORIGINAL PRESET MAY WORK BETTER THIS WAY, TOO.

Sorry to just now see this.

Last edited by Jake Johnson (31-12-2009 02:27)