OK first of all, to get down to the fact that I am not just commenting out of the fact. I have absolute pitch (thanks to David Lucas Burge PP ear training for helping me realize this, I have only done half the lessons, will finish them though).
I started with Pianoteq 2, I only use the concert grand at 9.6meters, After some months using this version, I downloaded the trial version of Pianoteq 3, and even after some tweaking as I did in the previous version, I cannot seem to accept the sound. Is is because I am used to the previous piano sound, do you think the new pianos sound better? Where is the old grand as was in Pianoteq 2.3?
P.S. Sorry I had to play the Perfect Pitch EAR card.
The sound simply improved, that's all. Yes, you are too accustomed to the old sound.
When I hear old PTQ2 nowadays, I can't help hearing the plasticness around it. PTQ3 breathes more, resonances are muuuuch better, and overall feel is greatly improved. I'd say everything got so much better that everyone should even forget v2 existed
Yeah, It's an excellent EAR Training program course, There is the Perfect Pitch and Relative Pitch, I have both, It is a good idea to invest in both, as they help each other. And if you get it from the David Lucas Burge website at Perfectpitch.com, you get a discount.
Mind you I am only a satisfied customer, I am not getting paid for this, Just spreading the good message.
With the relative pitch ear training, one need not worry about intervals, practially all intervals are covered if not all, the number of topics can be overwelming but just hold on to your head and you will be fine : )
OK, I have installed the new Pianoteq 3 demo version, to try and break away from the old sound (Pianoteq 2.3), yeah the sound is fuller but the resonance seem to be too much, anyone else notices this, and how will I be able to reduce it?
ViolinGOD
p.s. EvilDragon, what sort of music do you do transcriptions for and what do you use (paper or software)?
I'm using Guitar Pro 4 mostly. Well, I don't have time lately so I don't transcribe at all that much, but my former transcriptions were some heavy metal songs... I did a very good job, nailing songs at least 98%, or so... People were satisfied
You can reduce Resonance in the Design section
Although I find the resonances of v3 very appealing.
Some people say perfect pitch it's in part genetic.
The ears have many components, and in the deep in very end there are some nervous sensitive ciliums, which vibrates accoding to the sound. The more align, paralel the siliums, easier would be to distinguish frequencies. Also brain processing have some importance,as require to decorate each pitch sound.
Evil Dragon I want to see you take this Popeye introduction by ears. ;-)
Some people say perfect pitch it's in part genetic.
The ears have many components, and in the deep in very end there are some nervous sensitive ciliums, which vibrates accoding to the sound. The more align, paralel the siliums, easier would be to distinguish frequencies. Also brain processing have some importance,as require to decorate each pitch sound.
Evil Dragon I want to see you take this Popeye introduction by ears. ;-)
I still have very good ears, I think I can do really good transcriptions of songs and such.
Beto-music, probably your concept of part genetic is correct, but I think everyone has the ability to develop perfect pitch, however it will be almost impossible for someone who has over the years damaged some of the fine hairs that line the inner membrane of the cochlea which is never replaced by new hairs. For me, my ear is so sensitive that listening to some types of music I get physical pain, it's almost as if I can tell whether a piece works (sound wise), by whether it cause pain or pleasure.
It is definitely at least part genetic. I have perfect pitch. Actually, there's no such thing, without a reference tuning e.g. concert pitch to work to. A isn't A to everyone at every time and in every culture. I never understood Yngwie Malmsteen - who professes to have perfect pitch - and deliberately detunes his guitar from E to Eb - the guy even wrote a concerto for Electric Guitar and Orchestra in Eb Minor. WHY! I suppose he *had* to, since he never tunes to E, but most people wouldn't have known any different.
Perfect/Absolute pitch is a curse. I once sang solo at Durham Cathedral where the organ is quite sharp in pitch. I couldn't follow the music, it was as if every note was between two other notes and I couldn't discern the actual pitch. I once spent a very rainy August vacation in Scotland with only a very, very flat upright grand for company. For several days, I could barely play it as to me, every C was Bb etc etc. After a while I became accustomed to it but had to re-program myself to concert pitch when I returned home.
(This one time, at band camp...)
Also it is a nightmare singing unaccompanied with a choir, as most people's sense of pitch will drift and if you have "perfect pitch" you constantly feel yourself trying to correct the choir's tuning. A conductor I once sang under had the organist transpose the Harwood in Ab canticles into A - at sight - because he said flat keys caused flat singing.
To me, every key has a "flavour" even though in theory we're working with equal temperament and they shouldn't. Single notes to me sound like they have particular moods. I can't easily play in something like Werckmeister III as I find it excruciating in the "remote" keys, which I suppose is the point, or anti-point.
I say it is partly genetic because my mother has it (demonstrably) and doesn't play an instrument or even read music. She can sing jingles and TV signature tunes perfectly in key before they start on the TV.
I also don't think *everyone* can be taught it, even if they are extremely musical/have a high level of exposure to playing music. My Stepdad is constantly immersed in Beethoven and Bach but his tuning when playing Violin is quite approximate. I really do think he's blissfully unaware of the "problem"
I say *partly* genetic because I think exposure to music and a "musical memory" are also very important. I think my "note flavours" are partly due to remembering fragments of music where chordal voicings give individuality to separate notes. It is as if I "remember" notes with a "history" behind them. Beto-Music thinks he's odd. I doubt he's as odd as I am. I can't "do" background music, I can't concentrate with even the TV on in the background. Music is to be enjoyed, not used to conceal silence
I never understood Yngwie Malmsteen - who professes to have perfect pitch - and deliberately detunes his guitar from E to Eb - the guy even wrote a concerto for Electric Guitar and Orchestra in Eb Minor. WHY! I suppose he *had* to, since he never tunes to E, but most people wouldn't have known any different.
Eb tuning for guitar is THE power metal tuning. All the metalheads know that.
I believe my ears have some sensibility too, but I did not trained to detect well the notes. I took some simple music by ears, but in preference major scales. The teacher I had was boring and did not like to estimulate ears ability, and dislike improvisation while leaning and also dislike take by ears. He never wanted help me to get a music by ears. He was the kind of "music sheet thing only".
Now I have no teacher, cause I quit his teaching, and he was also use to not come in many days we sould get lesson. Funny, once I lend he use my digital piano for a small theater presentation (small city). But latter when he got a digital stage piano I asked hin if he would use to presantiations in theaters. He said would not risk his piano taking it up and dow to a theater. My piano worth to risk, but not his... :-(
We are losting a near halph generation of Perfect Pitch. The houlocaust of auditive fine hairs. The techno music, and other deafening music style it's causing some degree of premature hearing loss in a large number of young people. people 20 years old with the hearing of a 58 year old person.
One thing quite funny I saw once, is that the man start to lose more the hearing to trebble as get old, while woman lose more the hearing to bass. Since man's voice tend to bass, and women's voice tends to treble, both start to hear less each other.
So, maybe a solution to many marriages it's a digital:
johnbrown wrote:
Beto-Music wrote:
Some people say perfect pitch it's in part genetic.
The ears have many components, and in the deep in very end there are some nervous sensitive ciliums, which vibrates accoding to the sound. The more align, paralel the siliums, easier would be to distinguish frequencies. Also brain processing have some importance,as require to decorate each pitch sound.
Evil Dragon I want to see you take this Popeye introduction by ears. ;-)
I still have very good ears, I think I can do really good transcriptions of songs and such.
Beto-music, probably your concept of part genetic is correct, but I think everyone has the ability to develop perfect pitch, however it will be almost impossible for someone who has over the years damaged some of the fine hairs that line the inner membrane of the cochlea which is never replaced by new hairs. For me, my ear is so sensitive that listening to some types of music I get physical pain, it's almost as if I can tell whether a piece works (sound wise), by whether it cause pain or pleasure.
with regards to the resonance of the new pianoteq 3 demo, I found out that the reverberation was on by default, even after disabling it the piano is still too resonant, I am however working on getting used to it, but I very much dislike the M3 ( well the current sound anyway ).
To MODARTT, is it possible to get the M2 as was in the previous version of Pianoteq 2.3 into Pianoteq 3?
P.S. NeilCraig great points, it's true that even if one has the ability of perfect pitch we have to tune our ears to concert pitch. Our ears are very complex, once you have absolute pitch, it compensates for the tuning on not just your own instrument but on other 'pitched' instruments too. So on the fly your ear can adjust to the timbre and color of the notes from different instruments.
There was a brass band teacher, who said that had horrible ear to say what note was what. But if you told hin what note was, just the first note of a medium elaborated sequence, he could get the entire sequence.
Neil, I was wondering if it's possible to use a adapted digital hearing device assitance, in order to change the pitch a little to fit you in a choir with no problem.
Well, if today digital technology make possible to a digital filter to change the speed of a music without change the pitch, why wouldn't be possible change the pitch without change the music speed ???
You would be a bit robotic, adjusting the pitch of a digital device in your ears, but would no longer had "nightmares".
By the way, perhaps could be interesting to Modart split people in groups, classified by hearing capability in terms of pitch sensibility, and compare their opinions about pianoteq.
Philippe, what about a option to write the frequency of a key, in the key by key detune adjust?
It's just for a crazy mad idea I got, to build a 6 basic notes. I remamber a teacher saying that there was a history thar the chuch forbidden any 6 basic key instruments due the 666 devil number.
A silly legend, but why not try a experiment. Pianoteq could be adjusted to place a new frequency patern of notes, and mute the last note (B).
Who want to join this "mad doctor experiment"??? :-)
Philippe, what about a option to write the frequency of a key, in the key by key detune adjust?
It's just for a crazy mad idea I got, to build a 6 basic notes. I remamber a teacher saying that there was a history thar the chuch forbidden any 6 basic key instruments due the 666 devil number.
A silly legend, but why not try a experiment. Pianoteq could be adjusted to place a new frequency patern of notes, and mute the last note (B).
Who want to join this "mad doctor experiment"??? :-)
Alberto, yes you can (build any scale on 6 notes), and then you just need to ignore the B... or buy a microtonal keyboard. Which I guess requires some steep learning!
Hello, I am having problems with the midi files I recorded in Pianoteq 2.3, when I import it into Finale 2010, the result is every key depressed comes up as major or minor second, is this the program or is this a result of the hardware. I am using the Keystation pro 88 keyboard from M-Audio. Thanks
with regards to the resonance of the new pianoteq 3 demo, I found out that the reverberation was on by default, even after disabling it the piano is still too resonant, I am however working on getting used to it, but I very much dislike the M3 ( well the current sound anyway ).ViolinGOD
johnbrown: Many of the presets have a lot of room in the sound because of the mic positions. Try moving the mics in closer (or the virtual head) to get a closer sound. I've read several people describe different positions. Try a mic just above the strings and another in the singer\player position, but moved slightly to the left. The virtual head works well in that left of center position, too, although one must be careful to adjust the hammer noise and hardness as the mics get closer to the hammers. If the result shifts the sound to the left, increase the right channel volume for the mic. (I had forgotten about this until yesterday.)
I just typed the phrase "virtual head." Should the head have a name? (Shudder)
with regards to the resonance of the new pianoteq 3 demo, I found out that the reverberation was on by default, even after disabling it the piano is still too resonant, I am however working on getting used to it, but I very much dislike the M3 ( well the current sound anyway ).ViolinGOD
johnbrown: Many of the presets have a lot of room in the sound because of the mic positions. Try moving the mics in closer (or the virtual head) to get a closer sound. I've read several people describe different positions. Try a mic just above the strings and another in the singer\player position, but moved slightly to the left. The virtual head works well in that left of center position, too, although one must be careful to adjust the hammer noise and hardness as the mics get closer to the hammers. If the result shifts the sound to the left, increase the right channel volume for the mic. (I had forgotten about this until yesterday.)
I just typed the phrase "virtual head." Should the head have a name? (Shudder)
Thanks Jake Johnson, I'll try it as you sugested, I use a Sennheiser HD555 open headphones, does this make any difference to the sound? Will monitor speakers be a better choice?
Hello, I am having problems with the midi files I recorded in Pianoteq 2.3, when I import it into Finale 2010, the result is every key depressed comes up as major or minor second, is this the program or is this a result of the hardware. I am using the Keystation pro 88 keyboard from M-Audio. Thanks
I don't know those headphones. Monitors will give you a very different sound--my impression is that people use both, particularly if doing serious recording, to check out the validity of the sound being played on various systems.
The midi file problem seems very strange. Is it possible that the track in Finale has some kind of odd setting? Are you starting a new project from scratch? And come to think of it, have you tried opening the same midi file in other applications? That should tell you if the problem is Finale-specific, at least.
I don't know those headphones. Monitors will give you a very different sound--my impression is that people use both, particularly if doing serious recording, to check out the validity of the sound being played on various systems.
The midi file problem seems very strange. Is it possible that the track in Finale has some kind of odd setting? Are you starting a new project from scratch? And come to think of it, have you tried opening the same midi file in other applications? That should tell you if the problem is Finale-specific, at least.
Mama mia (if that is how one would spell it), never heard of the second best headphone maker?, I think BOSE is the at the top. You should try them, especially from the HD555 series and above, A bit expensive but worth it. With regards to the midi files in Finale 2010, I usually start projects from the orchestral templates, I will try an create a new one from scratch and also try the files in Sibelius, I deleted Sibelius 5 so will have to install it again, Thanks Jake.
P.S. if all else falls I will just have to use the mouse and the on-screen keyboard
I should have said "I know Sennheisers, but I've have never listened to music on that specific model."
I do see the HD555's mentioned fairly often, however. The pair of Sennheisers that I once had were good in the midrange and treble, but lacked bass. But I had a relatively inexpensive pair from the Sony Walkman era...
I should have said "I know Sennheisers, but I've have never listened to music on that specific model."
I do see the HD555's mentioned fairly often, however. The pair of Sennheisers that I once had were good in the midrange and treble, but lacked bass. But I had a relatively inexpensive pair from the Sony Walkman era...
Phew!, yeah they are great, I was hoping to get the one higher, the HD 595, it has a much lower Frequency response (12.....38,500 Hz) instead of 15.....28,000 Hz for the HD 555. Apart from this and the Total harmonic distortion (THD), no idea what that is!, I would have to pay more than twice for it. So I am saving up to get the BOSE system (the ACOUSTIC WAVE® music system II - DAB + free 5-CD changer to be exact), about £1000. Why does this sound like I am advertising the system...
To Pianoteq, is it possible to get a student discount on the Pianoteq 3 pro or the standard? I might give it a try, and hopefully get used to the sound. Thanks
Hey, I didn't want to open a topic for it, but someone (maybe Modartt?) , please start making flawed pianos, too You know, that detuned beaten faulty upright sound you can find mostly in school basements and in the victorian houses of the post apocalyptic films. Sounding somewhat like this: http://www.tonehammer.com/?p=556 Cheers, David
