Topic by Moby

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  • Moby
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  • Registered: 25-11-2007
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Topic: Pianoteq through PA

Hi,

I have a question not only related to Pianoteq but to amplified piano sound on stage in general. And when I read other forums, I see that I am not alone. Obviously it is not so easy to get a convincing piano sound through PA.

I am using Pianoteq in band playing (mainly Rhody and Wurly, for some songs also piano). For C3 and M3 I created some piano presets with close micing that sound quite ok when I use them only for accompaniment. But I do not dare to use them in solo parts, because I am not really satisfied with the sound.

In our band practice last week I made the mistake just to choose one of the D4 factory presets. I think it was "D4 Blues" or "D4 Jazz AB". When I heard the first few accords through the PA, I immediately asked myself the question: Why does it sound so awful? I tried these D4 presets through headphones and through the speakers of my digital piano at home before, and it made a lot of fun. So what is wrong here?

The next time I want to make a sound check, and my idea is to start with a dry piano sound with flat EQ and without reverb. But what should I do to improve the sound? Is it mostly EQ settings (where: Pianoteq or mixer)? Which frequencies do I need to emphasize or lower (typically)? Are there any other ideas?

Reply by Beto-Music

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Re: Pianoteq through PA

I created a topic some time ago:  "Why stage piano don't work on Stage???"


http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/viewtopic.php?id=867


I did because most recording, shows on TV, that use a digital piano on stage, had some artifitial sound, even the best sampled pianos on Earth.

I supose if you get a real piano recording, and put it through the stage typical system used for digital stage piano, the sound will not work well too.

I never really got a good answer for why this happens.

Last edited by Beto-Music (01-05-2012 00:27)

Reply by Michael H

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  • Michael H
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Re: Pianoteq through PA

I believe one reason for poor piano sound is when a piano sound is supposed to be in stereo, yet the PA is mono. In this instance, using a mono piano sound would be preferable. Depth is still lost, but phasing problems are avoided. Not a perfect scenario by any means.

Another reason may be that the PA is 'tuned' for vocal reproduction at the expense of piano and other instruments. In this case, having separate EQ and signal processing for the piano sound could help a lot.

Last edited by Michael H (01-05-2012 01:40)

Reply by Kramster

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Re: Pianoteq through PA

I am pretty sure when playing live on a real piano the only person that hears "stereo" is the player as he is sitting with the lows to his left etc... The audience hears pretty much mono... so why the heck don't we have a good mono piano preset for us to use in a stage situation all phased real nice like. My best mono sound with ok phasing is my ole trusty GEM pRP7 piano sound into a Bose... just sayin'.
  Haven't tried my 2 Bose Compacts with Pianoteq yet.

Reply by Luc Henrion

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Re: Pianoteq through PA

it depends on what you call "stereo"... if it's bass to the left and treble to the right, OK, the player is the only one to hear it (more or less) this way. Another concept of stereo is "space" or "depth" or whatever you call it that gives you something just a bit different for each ear !
BTW, you HAVE a "monophonic" choice in PT, should you wish so... even in sound recording mode, just disable all mic's bar one.

Last edited by Luc Henrion (01-05-2012 08:33)

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Reply by Beethree

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Re: Pianoteq through PA

My 2 cents......

Most if not all keyboard amps are not even enough for piano. Powered speakers are preferable and 3 way speakers even better.

Mono vs. Stereo as mentioned above. While you can get better sound for YOURSELF playing in stereo, most club PA systems are in mono, and you are often better off getting your stuff to sound as good as possible in mono, so you and the audience are hearing the same thing. I find that the monophonic setting in Pianoteq works better than most digital pianos in mono......but yes, you lose depth compared to sitting in front of your home monitors in stereo.

Reverb...needs to be used sparingly if at all. Sounds great on recordings, but if you amplify it, you are amplifying the sound of a room.....yet you are already IN a room....things get washy real fast. Clean, close and dry for most applications. If you are playing solo in a very small space, and you want it to be atmospheric, that may be a case where you want to use some verb.

Al that said.....this is of course all subjective, and depends on the context. This is just what works for me.