Topic by peitzmann

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Topic: Design Parameters: String Length and Soundboard

I have been looking at some of the design parameters to see how they work. In fact my main motivation was to demonstrate how the properties of the piano make for its characteristic sound by altering them to the extremes.

I was looking in particular at the string length, which should change the inharmonicity. Now I don't seem to get any audible variation in the piano sound by changing this parameter between the extreme settings. I admit that I tried this not on a high quality audio equipment, but I still I thought I should be able to hear it. Does this produce a difference for other people? I've been running 3.6.3 and tried any of the Grand Piano models. 

If this is meant to produce just such a subtle sound difference that I'm missing it, then that would translate into a wish to allow for more extreme settings.

And while I'm at this: If I understand correctly there is no lower cutoff of the soundboard characteristics that could be changed. I would very much appreciate that as a variable parameter.

Thomas

Reply by EvilDragon

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Re: Design Parameters: String Length and Soundboard

Changing string length to extremes certainly does change the sound. Ever so slightly, but it does. Notes sound cleaner with long string settings.

Tip: use headphones and set Pianoteq to Binaural output mode.

Hard work and guts!

Reply by peitzmann

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Re: Design Parameters: String Length and Soundboard

I checked again carefully, with Sennheiser HD580 headphones, and on my speakers. I can't hear any difference, when I vary the string length. I can easily hear variations for the other parameters I've tried like unison width, sympathetic resonance, or even soundboard cutoff (where it is very subtle for bass tones, but easily audible for treble), but nothing for string length. Well, I never thought my hearing was perfect, but that bad...

I've tried the standalone program and the plugin in Logic. So as you might notice, I'm on a Mac. Anybody else on a Mac care to comment?

Reply by EvilDragon

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Re: Design Parameters: String Length and Soundboard

I think it has nothing to do with Mac/PC difference. Pianoteq outputs the same sound regardless

Listen to this sound example: http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/uploads.p...20test.mp3

I first played one note at max velocity with minimum string length, then with maximum string length right after it. After that I added an octave below, still at max velocity.

I think the difference is rather obvious. The second sample of both sounds much clearer and less "rattly".

Hard work and guts!

Reply by Philippe Guillaume

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Re: Design Parameters: String Length and Soundboard

The difference in sound is the most noticeable in the bass range. This is due to the fact that the string lengths are calculated as for a real acoustic grand. The string length from medium range to trebble varies only a little from a baby grand to a concert grand, contrarily to the bass range. This is why you will hear the inharmonicity variation mostly in the bass range. Listen for example to the lowest C: there you should clearly hear the difference between a 1m and a 10m piano.

Philippe Guillaume's Website

Reply by EvilDragon

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Re: Design Parameters: String Length and Soundboard

Good thing I posted that sound example.

Hard work and guts!

Reply by peitzmann

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Re: Design Parameters: String Length and Soundboard

Thanks. For bass notes I can in fact hear a difference. It is subtle and I find it hardly noticeable in the mid and treble ranges, but it's there, agreed.

Now that you have mentioned the true length variations it is plausible that the effect is small. But would it be possible to allow for even stronger variations, even if those are beyond the usual range of a realistic grand?

Reply by Philippe Guillaume

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Re: Design Parameters: String Length and Soundboard

The limits are given by the model (and the shortest possible piano length), but each piano has its own inharmonicity, and if you like higher iH, try the Erard (from the KIViR free add-on collection), or the Bechstein which has an even higher iH. Besides, a "non orthodox" way of going even further is to lower the diapason while transposing the keyboard (for example diapason = 330 Hz and transpose = +5 (in the options/midi panel)).

Philippe Guillaume's Website