Topic: New laptop: ideal spec?

I am thinking of upgrading my 3-year old laptop for something that does most things a bit better especially wrt PTQ.

My current model has a AMD Turion 64 2.0 HHz CPU with 512KB L2 cache, 512MB RAM, WIN XP.

Early PTQ versions worked OK but I find later ones really struggle and I have to throttle the performance back considerably. Using PTQ as a vst is also problematical given that my Cakewalk sequencer appears to run the CPU at near 100% on its own!

A new model would likely have 2.1 GHz dual-core CPU. Does this provide a genuine doubling of CPU speed to cope with PTQ? And how is WIN 7 performing?

Any advice much appreciated.

Last edited by Paul (13-05-2010 11:58)

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

Paul wrote:

I am thinking of upgrading my 3-year old laptop for something that does most things a bit better especially wrt PTQ.

My current model has a AMD Turion 64 2.0 HHz CPU with 512KB L2 cache, 512MB RAM, WIN XP.

Early PTQ versions worked OK but I find later ones really struggle and I have to throttle the performance back considerably. Using PTQ as a vst is also problematical given that my Cakewalk sequencer appears to run the CPU at near 100% on its own!

A new model would likely have 2.1 GHz dual-core CPU. Does this provide a genuine doubling of CPU speed to cope with PTQ? And how is WIN 7 performing?

Any advice much appreciated.

I have a dual sore 2.0GHz intel T5750 processor. I have found that this is sufficient to run pianoteq at a good latency (384 samples at 32000 Hz internal sample rate and 96000 Hz host sample rate). There is no noticeable difference to audio quality between running the internal sample rate at 32000Hz or 48000Hz! Therefore, you will have ample room for pianoteq to evolve if you get a machine with, for example, an intel core i5 processor. I personally would buy a computer with an AMD processor. Intel always seem to be that much better! My wife has an intel core i5 computer, but i've never loaded  it with pianoteq! If you like, I could do so and let you know the results?

Chris

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

p.s. I'm in the UK too!!!

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

Sigasa, you must have hurt your laptop real bad, that it is dual sore???

sorry... couldn't resist

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

I would go for a MUCH faster processor if possible -- 2.6 GHz duo (or quad!) at least.  You're going to "hit the ceiling" pretty quickly with only 2.1 GHz.  (And go with Intel.  In many ways -- especially for a program like Pianoteq -- they are superior to AMD.)

Last edited by dhalfen (13-05-2010 14:38)
"Our developers, who art in Toulouse, hallowed be thy physical-models.
Thy version 4 come, thy new instruments be done, in the computer as it is in the wood!"

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

creart wrote:

Sigasa, you must have hurt your laptop real bad, that it is dual sore???

sorry... couldn't resist

I did resist

sigasa wrote:

I personally would buy a computer with an AMD processor. Intel always seem to be that much better! My wife has an intel core i5 computer, but i've never loaded  it with pianoteq! If you like, I could do so and let you know the results? Chris

Yes please, all help welcome. I presume you meant you would NOT buy AMD.

dhalfen wrote:

I would go for a MUCH faster processor if possible -- 2.6 GHz duo (or quad!) at least.  You're going to "hit the ceiling" pretty quickly with only 2.1 GHz.  (And go with Intel.  In many ways -- especially for a program like Pianoteq -- they are superior to AMD.)

Are you saying 2.1 GHz duo is insufficient as that's what I originally quoted I was looking at?

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

I meant i would NOT buy a computer with an AMD processor!

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

2ghz dual will be fine, my old laptop is AMD 1.5 dual and never had any problems at all, I just did a quick test on my desktop, set it to my personal huge power saving mode which underclocks CPU to 1273mhz dual core and was able to smash all keys with pedal at 128 polyphony with 55% CPU usage, this is at 44100 320 sample latency.

35-38% at 2064mhz dual just for your info.

Last edited by Graham (13-05-2010 17:55)

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

I'll check out pianoteq on my wifes' Intel i5 computer and let you know the stats

Chris

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

CPU

Intel Core i5 CPU M 430 @ 2.27GHz

(Pianoteq) Performance index 48

Audio load less than 25%

Multicore rendering enabled

SAMPLE RATE

Internal 32000Hz

Host       96000Hz

Buffer     192 Samples (2.0ms)

POLYPHONY

256 (MAX)

E-MU XMidi 1x1

ASIO E-MU 0202 USB

Will post mp3 of test which caused no glitches or cutouts!

Computer not yet streamlined for audio! Yet results speak for themselves.

EDIT: heres the mp3 of the successful test
http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/uploads.p...20test.mp3

Last edited by sigasa (13-05-2010 21:52)

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

I just ordered a Dell Studio 14 with core i3 specifically for pianoteq.
The core i3 2.13 ghz is now $599-- I upgraded to 2.26 ghz for $35.

http://www.dell.com/us/en/home/notebook...amp;~ck=mn

I was looking for something that has an expresscard/34 so I could use an Echo Indigo expresscard, and the Dell studios have 'em.  Used to run pianoteq on a PCMCIA Echo Indigo through Senn 580's and loved the sound.  Super low latency also--better even than firewire.

The core i3 is basically the i5 without turbo boost, which wouldn't kick in anyway if you are running two cores simultaneously. The i3 runs benchmarks in the range of the fastest core 2 duos but uses much less juice.

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Mobile-Pro...436.0.html

Pianoteq 5, Dell Studio 14 (core i3 2.26 ghz), M-Audio Uno midi connector, Echo Indigo Djx (expresscard), Little Dot MK V Headphone Amp, Senn 580 Headphones, Kawai MP9000 digital piano

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

Thanks for all the replies - plenty to work on. I too have an optional Echo Indigo sound card that needs a 54mm cardbus slot as does my Firewire card that I use for a  different hobby - video editing.

Cardbus slots, especially 54mm, seem to be becoming a thing of the past - HP have the best choice of models with those, some even with dedicated firewire.

So it's a balancing act as usual but many of the models with i5 CPUs may be a bit pricey.

On with the search...

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

Also be careful with battery cells time. Some HP computers are pretty powerful but have short battery life (1 hour, 3 hours). MacbookPro has 7 to 10 hours (in the new models).
Sometimes a little extra saves a lot of hassles.

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

Ciel Rose wrote:

Also be careful with battery cells time. Some HP computers are pretty powerful but have short battery life (1 hour, 3 hours). MacbookPro has 7 to 10 hours (in the new models).
Sometimes a little extra saves a lot of hassles.

True enough but I rarely use without power so not my top priority. Thanks anyway.

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

Of course, now I am realising all the hassle relating to Windows 7 compatibility issues that will come with a new machine. PTQ will be OK but my Cakewalk sequencer for one won't be and will need upgrading. More expense...

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

- Sony Vaio 13"3 / core i5 M540 @ 2.53 Ghz / 6 Go DDR3 Ram / 128 Go SSD
running win 7 64 (soon will run XP 64 SP3)
- Hosted in Live 8 with soft VST plugin chain (preamp / EQ / Reverb) and with no other midi vst track and no audio tracks running, just PTQ
- Soundcard : Presonus Firebox or RME Fireface UC : 256 samples (< 4 ms)
- Midi keyboard is Roland RD700GX with Medium keyboard response

For a live instrumental playing (with harp, guitar and voices) sometimes using very long sustained notes with heavy polyphony

Everything is stable and fine.

Using the Sound Recording Section, it's very hard to tweak the phase microphones  configuration : at first the result truly depends on your monitoring set quality (for me headphones are not the best to do this). The sound of your piano can radically change even with a subtle different mic placement changing. But this section is definitely amazing for those who like tweaking and testing the sound at millimeters.

Depending on soundcard settings / performance, the ability to support full polyphony play works from 128 to 256 simultaneous notes.

I think that things depend on:

- not just your processor computer performance
- but also the performance of your soundcard
- how you tweak the Design Section of PTQ : if you set a too longer impedance / string length / sympathetic resonance then your CPU will be dramatically in charge, particularly if you have a heavy foot pedal sustain use

Last edited by darkunst (02-06-2010 15:15)

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

I just got my new Dell Studio 1558, with an i5 430.(4 GB ram ,64 bit win7)
It's a real beast - it eats two pianoteq instances + "my drumset" + compression + reverb + audio track with plenty of room for more ...
I wanted something with an i5, and with a firewire interface, so there were not many choices out there.

I can verify the "48" index in pianoteq, when running the "high performance" power scheme.
Though playing standalone, you don't really need the "high performance" scheme, going easier on the battery, getting an index around 25.

P.S and I love the red finish :-)

-- Eran

Last edited by etalmor (27-06-2010 14:57)
M-Audio Profire 610 / Roland Fp-3 / Reaper / PianoTeq!
www.myspace.com/etalmor

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

Nice system! I'm getting performance index of 45 on the core i3 350 dell studio 14 with Echo Indigo djx expresscard.   The echo indigo has *just* enough output for good volume on my Senn 580's, though I have to crank everything up to max and put the Pianoteq volume on +8 db.

Still playing around with the power settings--I'm using 96khz with 128 sample buffer.  One thing new in Windows 7(to me) is the cpu throttling.  Default minimum CPU setting for the high performance mode is 5%--so the clock will throttle up and down, and so far I get the best performance with 50% minimum clock. I get a performance index of 36 with that setting.

Pianoteq 5, Dell Studio 14 (core i3 2.26 ghz), M-Audio Uno midi connector, Echo Indigo Djx (expresscard), Little Dot MK V Headphone Amp, Senn 580 Headphones, Kawai MP9000 digital piano

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

Just wanted to report back on the Echo Indigo/Sennheiser 580 combo.

It's possible to get enough volume, but I'm finding that the Limiter kicks in so much at +8db volume that the pianos sometimes sound kind of muted. So I'd recommend lower impedance phones using the Echo Indigo (eg AKG K240 MKII @55ohms) rather than the 300ohm impedance Senn 580/600, unless you add an additional headphone amp.

The sound from the Echo/Indigo + Senn 580 is amazing, though. Just need a little more power.

All the pianos sound better to me with the limiter turned off, especially the K1.

Last edited by bebop603 (10-07-2010 01:25)
Pianoteq 5, Dell Studio 14 (core i3 2.26 ghz), M-Audio Uno midi connector, Echo Indigo Djx (expresscard), Little Dot MK V Headphone Amp, Senn 580 Headphones, Kawai MP9000 digital piano

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

Update:

I bought the AKG K240 MKII headphones, and after burning them in for a few days, I tried them with my setup.  The Echo Indigo doesn't drive them any louder than the Senn HD580! About the same volume.

So looks like it's headphone amp time. My choice:
http://headphonesamplifier.com/little-d...erpre-amp/

Getting a little off-topic here, but my subjective impression of the AKG K240 vs the Senn HD580:

The K240 sounds clear with good base extension.
But the HD580 is definitely in a different league: Warmer, more detailed, and more musical sound.  The C3 and M3 really sound authentic and beautiful on the Senns.  To my ears, the AKG just can't capture the timbre of the instruments with as much detail or realism.

IMO, the K1 suffers a little bit with the Senns for some reason.

Pianoteq 5, Dell Studio 14 (core i3 2.26 ghz), M-Audio Uno midi connector, Echo Indigo Djx (expresscard), Little Dot MK V Headphone Amp, Senn 580 Headphones, Kawai MP9000 digital piano

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

bebop603 wrote:

To my ears, the AKG just can't capture the timbre of the instruments with as much detail or realism.

Did you try the AKG K-701 ( more expensive indeed)?

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

I have the volume close to max, but I think my Echo Indigo + HD580s are loud enough. Look after your ears!

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

mooks wrote:

I have the volume close to max, but I think my Echo Indigo + HD580s are loud enough. Look after your ears!


(LOL) the pianos can get loud enough when I have the pianoteq volume +6-+8 with the echo indigo on max, but then the limiter has to be engaged. At that volume, though,  the limiter really kicks in and kills a lot of the dynamics and resonance.  I really like all of the pianos with the limiter completely off. But who knows, maybe 10+ years of ipod use is starting to catch up with me.

BTW, I'm using the the echo indigo djx (express card version).  I seem to remember that the original pcmcia version, which I used to have, was louder?

Haven't tried the AKG 701. I'm sure that is properly amped these are up there with the Senns. Once I get a headphone amp, I'll check to see if that improves the K240 MKII.

Last edited by bebop603 (10-07-2010 19:52)
Pianoteq 5, Dell Studio 14 (core i3 2.26 ghz), M-Audio Uno midi connector, Echo Indigo Djx (expresscard), Little Dot MK V Headphone Amp, Senn 580 Headphones, Kawai MP9000 digital piano

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

Ah, my Indigo is the PCMCIA one, so maybe it is louder. I have the card close to max, and Pianoteq at 0db. At this level, other sources such as heavily compressed peak-level audio can make me leap out of my chair!

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

Athlon single core 2.21 ghz / Mackie onyx 400F here on windows 7. I run pianoteq at 128 buffer latency fine, but 256 is good enough on my system. Even 64 works, but it's really no point.

Keep in mind that differend soundcards and even drivers can give varying latency. For example; the latency on my system is much worse on the stock ASIO or WDM (through Sonar) drivers than ASIO4ALL for some reason.

Re: New laptop: ideal spec?

In my case:
Dell Note Studio 1535
windows vista home premium
Intel Core2 Duo 2.10GHz
4GB HDD320GB
There is no strees to use PianoTeq.