Topic: How does "Dynamics" interact with the Volume curve?

Well, I guess I'm on a roll this morning, my mind a-racing with questions that have been forming for a while.  Here's the latest:  Dynamics.

From my understanding, the way that volume, velocity, and attack response works in Pianoteq is the following:

The Velocity Curve maps the velocity of the key strike against the attack or tone produced by the instrument, without necessarily increasing the volume in the same fashion. In other words, a more aggressive key strike should sound sharper and more distinct. In fact, just by using a more convex-upwards volume curve, you can produce a brighter-sounding instrument because each key strike will be interpreted more aggressively in its tone. The absolute volume produced from your speakers is directed by a separate relationship as driven by the Volume setting.

What I don't understand is how Dynamics plays into this. Dynamics seems to be some type of threshold setting, either limiting lower volume from occurring, or lower responses on the velocity curve, or both. Taken to the extreme left, it gives one volume and tonal response no matter how hard or how soft you strike the key. This, appears to be the same as drawing a flat line on the Velocity Curve. Such a flat curve is important for instruments such as the Hammond organs, etc., where the dynamics are fixed.

Somewhere I saw posted that a typical acoustic grand piano has about 67 dB of volume range, or dynamics, between the softest piano note and the loudest forte note. If this is so, then why do so many of the presets that are produced in Pianoteq place the Dynamics setting fairly low, such as in the mid-30s to mid-40s? Those virtual pianos can still be played fairly softly, and yet they still maintain a very aggressive presence.

I am hoping for a little insight and understanding into how this works and how it is supposed to work, and then suggestions on appropriate levels for the Dynamics setting, especially as interacting with more convex or less convex Velocity Curves.

– David

- David

Re: How does "Dynamics" interact with the Volume curve?

Velocity curve = timbral changes. Dynamics slider = volume changes (dB difference between velocity 1 and velocity 127). This is explained in the manual...

Hard work and guts!

Re: How does "Dynamics" interact with the Volume curve?

I got that, I think, but don't know how/where to use it.

What would be realistic Dynamics settings for some upright, parlor, and full grand pianos?

Even better control, then, would be assignable with a separate 2-dimensional curve of volume versus velocity.  I don't know if this Dynamics control is linear or a set non-linear curve shape.

( Perhaps having such better control would just prompt even more emails from me!  ...not necessarily a good thing.  I appreciate the responses, though. )

- David

- David

Re: How does "Dynamics" interact with the Volume curve?

You decide on your own settings, do whatever sounds best to you.

Hard work and guts!

Re: How does "Dynamics" interact with the Volume curve?

EvilDragon wrote:

Velocity curve = timbral changes. Dynamics slider = volume changes

Isn't it more like this? ->

velocity = value that indicates how forcefully a note was played
velocity curve = mapping of velocity values to other velocity values
timbre = function of velocity
volume = function of velocity and dynamic range and timbre

Re: How does "Dynamics" interact with the Volume curve?

Yeah, I think so, which is why I am confused.  But " what sounds right" is all that matters  - perception and all that.  I'm just frustrated that my morning perception differs from my evening perception, and so forth.

Measureability, accuracy, consistent reproducibility beats rough windage all the time.

- David

Re: How does "Dynamics" interact with the Volume curve?

dklein wrote:

What would be realistic Dynamics settings for some upright, parlor, and full grand pianos?

It is very difficult to say.

For me, the Dynamic set to 37-38 gives me the same kind of feeling as on my upright piano (very important!: with the velocity curve set as a line from 0-0 to 127-127, and with the sensitivity on my keyboard (Roland PHA3) set to 50).
To 40-42, it gives me the same kind of feeling as on my teacher's grand.

In facts:

1st step: set the keyboard sensitivity so that it is possible to play notes from ppp to fff (visual and finger setting using Pianoteq's main screen)
2nd step: set the Dynamic (this setting is made with the fingers, with the feel of the keyboard. In my opinion, if the setting of the sensitivity is correct, the dynamic shouldn't differ more than 10% of the factory value)
3rd step adjust slightly the curve to obtain what you want (setting with the ears)

Last edited by stamkorg (21-08-2016 20:30)