Topic by 2046

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Topic: Why mono sound more real to me?

Hey there

I have one question related to the sound quality and I wonder if someone else has the same or similar feeling.

I have the Pianoteq standard version and all setups I have tried, all "classical" pianos sound to me better when running thru mono output.
I have Genelecs M30 in free space pointing to me as they should, the room is acusticaly treated not 100% perfect, but no base stands in the room and no flatter echo and stuff. So I guess the stereo imaging is not twisted in any crucial way. But still the mono output sounds more real.. in comparison to my old Petrof Grand .)
Sure the stereo imaging is gone but ...
Is it because the sound picture goes more infront of me as like the piano body does or .. what is that?
I think it is not just the space presence but the whole quaility is more crisp and right there compare to stereo that sounds more mellow, polished and sure bit distant.
It is also wort to mention that if I speak about the "better" quality I mean quality of a piano staying next to you not a feeling you get from piano on stage or concert hall and so.

Last edited by 2046 (08-09-2015 13:00)

Reply by jcfelice88keys

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Re: Why mono sound more real to me?

Hello Mr. 2046,

Your Genelec monitors are very good monitors, especially in terms of imaging.  Taking into account that you have acoustically treated your room, and that the Gens are positioned in free space, I imagine that you are basking in the pleasure of hearing "pinpoint imaging" that seems to float directly in front of your head.

I don't know if the Standard version allows you to go into the Stereo Recording window, and adjust the slider for Stereo Spread.  If this is possible for you to do in the Standard version, you might try moving the slider all the way to the left (mono).  After having achieved the mono effect, you might want to move the slider just slightly to the right.  Surely, you should be able to find that the sonic image still floats in front of your head, but does have a little side-to-side information to it as well.

Food for thought,

Joe

Last edited by jcfelice88keys (08-09-2015 19:29)

Reply by Modellingoptimist

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Re: Why mono sound more real to me?

Hello 2046,

how do you like the "Stereophonic" output and do you think hard panning in "Sound Recording" mode improves the default sound of the presets? Thanks.

Cheers

formerly known as Notyetconvinced

Reply by GRB

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Re: Why mono sound more real to me?

Whatever sounds best is best.

Pianoteq Pro 7.x - Kubuntu Linux 19.10 - Plasma Desktop - Hamburg Steinway

Reply by groovy

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Re: Why mono sound more real to me?

Yes, I'm a mono-addict too.  A mono sound source in a real room has more punch and directness than any room-simulation or phantom sound sources IMHO. Stereo is too often a mess with "phasiness".

Reply by Chopin87

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Re: Why mono sound more real to me?

It's probably related to phase issues. It seems that a distant microphone pair (AB) in pianoteq provides a wide sense of space but the sound wanders a lot. To solve this  you can use mono, a XY or MS setup. The image will be stereo but will have less phase issues. Another way would be to correct the stereo image via an external FX plugin.

"And live to be the show and gaze o' the time."  (William Shakespeare)

Reply by Modellingoptimist

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Re: Why mono sound more real to me?

GRB wrote:

Whatever sounds best is best.

From an artistic point of view, which is undoubtedly very important, yes. But when we talk about realness things become more objective. Phase cancellation e. g. can be minimized.

sengpielaudio.com is a huge German knowledge data base on audio engineering. There I found a remarkable passage on panning. If I understand it right my assumption regarding phase cancellation is right for AB and near-coincident pair stereo techniques: http://www.sengpielaudio.com/Panoramaregler-Panpot.pdf

Last edited by Modellingoptimist (09-09-2015 17:59)
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Reply by GRB

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Re: Why mono sound more real to me?

Modellingoptimist wrote:
GRB wrote:

Whatever sounds best is best.

From an artistic point of view, which is undoubtedly very important, yes. But when we talk about realness things become more objective. Phase cancellation e. g. can be minimized.

sengpielaudio.com is a huge German knowledge data base on audio engineering. There I found a remarkable passage on panning. If I understand it right my assumption regarding phase cancellation is right for AB and near-coincident pair stereo techniques: http://www.sengpielaudio.com/Panoramaregler-Panpot.pdf

My statement is taken from  Peter Schickele (PDQ Bach) about music in general, "If it sounds good, it is good."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Schickele

Pianoteq Pro 7.x - Kubuntu Linux 19.10 - Plasma Desktop - Hamburg Steinway

Reply by jcfelice88keys

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Re: Why mono sound more real to me?

GRB wrote:

My statement is taken from  Peter Schickele (PDQ Bach) about music in general, "If it sounds good, it is good."


And Peter Schickele acknowledged many times on his weekly syndicated radio program that he was quoting the late, great Duke Ellington.