Topic by TheBayer

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  • TheBayer
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Topic: Problem with Sympathetic Resonance

So I've been very impressed with Pianoteq 3.  I had checked it out in its early days and not been so thrilled, but I was in love with the concept.

Recently a friend asked about pianos and synthesis and I decided to check out Pianoteq again.  I am very impressed now, but I notice a really nasty limitation to the current Sympathetic Resonance model.  Currently it only seems to be active when holding down the sustain pedal.  Though this is certainly a time you would notice it, the other common case is not modeled.

If you have adjacent notes held down, you should hear sympathetic resonance in the held notes as well.  Depending on how the current system works this could either be very simple to implement (if there is a impulse placed on adjacent key strings) or very hard (if the sympathetic resonance is handled as a impulse response for the whole soundboard worth of strings).

Is this something that could/would readily be fixed?

Reply by jcfelice88keys

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Re: Problem with Sympathetic Resonance

TheBayer wrote:

<....>
If you have adjacent notes held down, you should hear sympathetic resonance in the held notes as well.

Hello Mr. Bayer,

As far as I understand, Pianoteq already does incorporate this form of sympathetic resonance with other notes that are depressed -- the only caveat is that the extra notes you have played ... need to be aligned with the natural harmonic series of the original note, for them to be heard.  This specifically does not require that the damper pedal be depressed for you to hear the effect.

The best way for you to demonstrate it for yourself is to slowly depress and hold down a C major chord, around Middle C.  As these strings are not vibrating, but their particular dampers are released, now "punch" a loud, staccato low C note, two octaves below middle C -- with no pedals held down during this experiment.

What you will hear, after punching and releasing the low C, is the original C major chord now resonating in those previously quiet C, E and G strings.  Those nine (3 tones times 3 strings per tone) undampened strings are now vibrating in sympathy with the corresponding 4th, 5th and 6th overtones in the natural harmonic series of that low C note.

As is correct to theory, if you had played a low E while still holding the original C major chord, you will correctly hear only the middle E note in the C Major chord, because the C and the G of that chord do not correspond to the natural harmonic series of that low E.

Hopefully this helps convince you that, what you wish for ... already exists in the Pianoteq model.


Cheers,

Joe

Reply by Glenn NK

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  • Glenn NK
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Re: Problem with Sympathetic Resonance

Another take on what Joe said:

I often get to look at several grands (a friend is a dealer/tech) and I occasionally check SR by holding one key while striking the appropriate one below (having a senior moment here as I forget the interval - I think I strike the one a fifth below the one I'm holding silently).

Incidentally, I find that the amount of resonance varies considerably varies from piano to piano.

With my own digital with Pianoteq, I do the same test, and adjust the amount of SR to approximate that of the C7 Yamaha.

From this, I know that Pianoteq does model SR very well - it may be even more consistent than that of an acoustic piano.

Try the test on an acoustic, then on Pianoteq - I think you might be surprised.

Glenn

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Reply by TheBayer

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Re: Problem with Sympathetic Resonance

Ah, right you are... I was thinking about it wrong.  It works just fine.