Topic by fakemaxwell

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Topic: Microphone preset levels in Steinways are...strange

The microphones in the Steinway NY, Hamburg, and B presets are mostly asymmetrical, for reasons I don't understand. 

For instance, in the Player Clean preset on the NY, the left mic is at 0db, the right mic is at -2db.  The left mic is delayed 1.3ms as well, and physically it's slightly further away than the right mic.

Can somebody explain the thought process behind this?  All the other models I looked at (Bechstein, Petrof, Steingraeber, Grotrian, Bluthner) all have symmetrical mics.  It seems to have been a conscious effort to do so, but based on my knowledge of recording I can't figure this one out.

Reply by dklein

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Re: Microphone preset levels in Steinways are...strange

"Inquiring minds want to know!"

Me as well.  As I have been learning to use an equalizer in a DAW to tame my transducer-driven soundboard, I have been curious about this and other Pianoteq microphone practices:

1)  Why the asymmetry?

2)  Why, especially in "Player" microphone set-ups, do the left and right mics get mixed into each the left and right stereo tracks?  Why not just 'hard-pan' the right mic to the right channel, and the left mic to the left channel?

3)  Why are the mics set up with different delays/phasing?  I can understand why with two mics, one above the soundboard, and one below the soundboard, should have 180-degree opposite phasing, as when the soundboard is traveling towards the top mic, it's traveling away from the underneath mic, etc.

Let's see if we get some answers back.

- David

- David

Reply by fakemaxwell

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Re: Microphone preset levels in Steinways are...strange

dklein wrote:

"Inquiring minds want to know!"


- David

2 in your list can be useful sometimes, as it's sort of mimicking how our ears hear.  Some of what the right ear hears will bleed into the left ear, delayed by the time it takes to get around your head.  It can be a little more natural sounding that hard panning.

That is at least a taste thing, the others I don't know about at all.

Reply by Philippe Guillaume

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Re: Microphone preset levels in Steinways are...strange

In general, the delays and levels are adjusted in such a way to obtain a centered and balanced image, and the amount of cross mixing brings additional warmth. The possible asymmetry simply reflects the asymmetry of the piano itself (soundboard, lid, etc.). However I'm not sure that the NY Player Clean preset setting is appropriate, it may be be better to have -1 dB on both mics and no delay at all. It will be fixed in a future release.

Philippe Guillaume's Website

Reply by YvesTh

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Re: Microphone preset levels in Steinways are...strange

Philippe Guillaume wrote:

However I'm not sure that the NY Player Clean preset setting is appropriate, it may be be better to have -1 dB on both mics and no delay at all. It will be fixed in a future release.

Very interesting... I mainly use pianoteq for the playing and with headphones. My preference goes logically towards the "binaural" and "player" presets. However, I had eliminated the "NY Steinway clean player" preset from my favorites, I didn't know where the problem was, but the sound in headphones was unpleasant for me and I didn't know what parameters to change. your suggestion with delay setting modification make the sound good with headphones. It seems to me that specific presets for headphones would be a good thing (and more binaural presets). Thank you...

Reply by dklein

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Re: Microphone preset levels in Steinways are...strange

Thanks, Philippe.

I have been ignoring the microphone settings for a while and have been learning EQ and compression to try to get the best sound possible overall from my transducers on my soundboard, but will no doubt go back to the microphones after things are better set for general playing.  I am surprised at how much my driven soundboard is away from 'neutral' in its coloration.

- David