Topic by miiindbullets

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Topic: Polyphonic Aftertouch + Classical Guitar

Hello all. I recently picked up an ASM Hydrasynth Explorer which has polyphonic aftertouch. I was hoping to be able to use that to bend individual strings on the new Pianoteq Classical Guitar, but can't seem to figure out if that's possible.

If I go into note edit, I can adjust "Aftertouch Sensitivity" per-note, but I'm not even sure if aftertouch is mapped to any modulation on this instrument, or maybe this only works with channel AT? Does anyone know if there's a place to map aftertouch to something like tuning?

Of course I could use the pitch stick/pad on my MIDI controllers, but that affects all 6 strings.

Has anyone had any luck implementing poly AT with the new guitar? Thanks!

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Reply by miiindbullets

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Re: Polyphonic Aftertouch + Classical Guitar

Of course it was right under my nose! For anyone who might stumble across this, click the left arrow next to "Velocity Curve" to get to the "Aftertouch" menu. Drag the right side to the top, and as you lean into the keys it'll bend the strings proportionally:

https://i.imgur.com/Ci45l03.jpg

Edit: I'm not sure what's meant by "mono" aftertouch (channel aftertouch maybe?), but I can confirm using a Hydrasynth to send poly aftertouch to Pianoteq will bend strings independently of each other. Pretty neat!

Last edited by miiindbullets (29-11-2022 17:58)
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Reply by aWc

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Re: Polyphonic Aftertouch + Classical Guitar

Cool! I'll be sure to try this with my Hydra Deluxe!

miiindbullets wrote:

Of course it was right under my nose! For anyone who might stumble across this, click the left arrow next to "Velocity Curve" to get to the "Aftertouch" menu. Drag the right side to the top, and as you lean into the keys it'll bend the strings proportionally:

https://i.imgur.com/Ci45l03.jpg

Edit: I'm not sure what's meant by "mono" aftertouch (channel aftertouch maybe?), but I can confirm using a Hydrasynth to send poly aftertouch to Pianoteq will bend strings independently of each other. Pretty neat!

PT 7.3 with Steinway B and D, U4 upright, YC5, Bechstein DG, Steingraeber, Ant. Petrov, Kremsegg Collection #2, Electric Pianos and Hohner Collection. http://antoinewcaron.com

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Reply by Key Fumbler

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Re: Polyphonic Aftertouch + Classical Guitar

The terms mono and channel aftertouch are interchangeable, they mean the same thing.

Poly aftertouch or poly AT allows for individual aftertouch intensity per key.

Mono, global or channel AT (aftertouch ) applies across all the keys, unless "last played" (applying AT to only the last key to be pressed down) is programmed into a synthesizer or sample player.

"Last Played" is a neat software trick in some software synths to allow mono AT to perform in a manner more similar to poly AT.

Mono aftertouch works well with breath/wind controllers.
MIDI Keyboards also get mono AT because it's cheaper to add a single AT strip than individual switches per key.

It would be great if Modartt could add this synth trick into Pianoteq's AT.

Last edited by Key Fumbler (29-11-2022 20:42)

Reply by aWc

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Re: Polyphonic Aftertouch + Classical Guitar

Key Fumbler wrote:

It would be great if Modartt could add this synth trick into Pianoteq's AT.

Oops, I mistakenly thought it was already an option...my bad

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Reply by Key Fumbler

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Re: Polyphonic Aftertouch + Classical Guitar

aWc wrote:
Key Fumbler wrote:

It would be great if Modartt could add this synth trick into Pianoteq's AT.

Oops, I mistakenly thought it was already an option...my bad

Well almost.  It's got two other lesser options that are nonetheless better than a global only note bending option (the typical mono aftertouch response option). 

It's got "only the highest active note" as an option. Not the same as last pressed which is even better as it could be any note.

You can also choose to limit AT to specific notes too.

Unless what you are describing is exclusive to the new guitar? - I disabled that as while I'm impressed with it I haven't chosen to buy it at this time.

Last edited by Key Fumbler (29-11-2022 23:33)

Reply by miiindbullets

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Re: Polyphonic Aftertouch + Classical Guitar

Key Fumbler wrote:

"Last Played" is a neat software trick in some software synths to allow mono AT to perform in a manner more similar to poly AT.

Very cool idea! I agree, it would be great to get native support for this in Pianoteq.

Another approach in the meantime could be to implement the "last played" conversion from channel to poly AT via your DAW, especially if your DAW supports scripting (Bitwig, Reaper, etc). Here's an example with Reaper:

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=20347

I couldn't find a VST that does it, but did find a standalone app that may be interesting to someone reading this thread:

http://www.bwalk.com.au/ChannelToKey/ChannelToKey.html

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Reply by Key Fumbler

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Re: Polyphonic Aftertouch + Classical Guitar

miiindbullets wrote:
Key Fumbler wrote:

"Last Played" is a neat software trick in some software synths to allow mono AT to perform in a manner more similar to poly AT.

Very cool idea! I agree, it would be great to get native support for this in Pianoteq.

Another approach in the meantime could be to implement the "last played" conversion from channel to poly AT via your DAW, especially if your DAW supports scripting (Bitwig, Reaper, etc). Here's an example with Reaper:

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=20347

I couldn't find a VST that does it, but did find a standalone app that may be interesting to someone reading this thread:

http://www.bwalk.com.au/ChannelToKey/ChannelToKey.html


A YT synth guy called Tim Shoebridge came up with a another solution of sorts to simulate it:
https://youtu.be/_wjNxV48r2w

Reply by miiindbullets

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Re: Polyphonic Aftertouch + Classical Guitar

Looks cool!

Also, I realized while it doesn't have the "last played" option you mentioned, Pianoteq provides the option to apply channel pressure to either the highest active note or anything above a certain note.

https://i.imgur.com/GN3IK3e.jpg

Last edited by miiindbullets (30-11-2022 20:00)
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Reply by Key Fumbler

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Re: Polyphonic Aftertouch + Classical Guitar

miiindbullets wrote:

Looks cool!

Also, I realized while it doesn't have the "last played" option you mentioned, Pianoteq provides the option to apply channel pressure to either the highest active note or anything above a certain note.

Yes, I mentioned that in post six.

Reply by miiindbullets

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Re: Polyphonic Aftertouch + Classical Guitar

Key Fumbler wrote:

Yes, I mentioned that in post six.

Ha! You sure did.

I'm really enjoying my current setup after getting it dialed in. Using a CP88 + Hydrasynth Explorer, although I need to get a sturdier stand for the Hydrasynth because it's moving around a lot on me. My laptop stand wasn't meant to withstand this kind of aftertouch abuse.

I also want to spend some time building a preset in the Hydrasynth to control all the Pianoteq params from the scribble strips/encoders. It's a really neat combo!

Here's some improv to demonstrate: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAgMzbRN2-U

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Reply by Key Fumbler

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Re: Polyphonic Aftertouch + Classical Guitar

Very nice work on the improv. Sounds great.

I wish Hydrasynth was also available as it's controller only. I don't really want to pay for all that internal sounds malarkey to get those performance features.
A 61 or 73 key controller version would be welcome.

Reply by miiindbullets

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Re: Polyphonic Aftertouch + Classical Guitar

Thanks! Yeah, I'm a little surprised ASM still hasn't released a controller yet.

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