olepro wrote:

Sounds like you have some kind of midi loop going on, and this would result in a phasey sound, if notes are triggered multiple times.
How is your keyboard connected?

Thank you.

I don't think so, a phasey sound is not what I'm hearing, just a very thin tone between A3 and D5. I get a phasey sound if I run the audio out of the Nord thru audio signal path while simultaneously running the MIDI through pianoteq (I'm not doing both at same time--it sounds like crap).

Good thought, but no MIDI loop:
Running a very standard MIDI signal path:
Nord MIDI out->5-pin DIN MIDI cable->MOTU midi express 128 midi interface->USB cable-> USB in to Mac

Pianoteq settings are listening to the NORD, no other board, no other software running that would generate a MIDI signal.

Unless Pianoteq is generating something to create a loop, I'm thinking a loop is not the issue.

You mentioned you have also a Hammond XK5, where's connected? That can be what is creating the loop.

Also, the USB cable could be sending MIDI data bidirectionally, and some MIDI-through setting on the computer might hypothetically send the data back to the MOTU which might hypothetically send it back to the computer again.

If the Nord has USB-MIDI, just for a test you can give it a try and see if a direct connection changes anything with this issue -- unless you have uninstalled the demo after the purchase.

If you leave the volume where it was, does the sound continue to be as synthetic as it was before?

Key Fumbler wrote:

Hopefully you have some decent headphones too. Even if you don't use them much it's good to have that frame of reference.

GREAT thought, definitely need to pursue that. My only headphones are fairly low-to-mid range Sony MDR-V6.

Can you suggest something that would really be nice - maybe crystalline highs and booming bass?

Thank you!

You don't want boom and tizz to accurately assess sound you want accurate monitoring headphones like Sennheiser HD600 or HD650.

Hopefully you have some decent headphones too. Even if you don't use them much it's good to have that frame of reference.

GREAT thought, definitely need to pursue that. My only headphones are fairly low-to-mid range Sony MDR-V6.

Can you suggest something that would really be nice - maybe crystalline highs and booming bass?

Thank you!

I hope I've solved both the problem of tone and "too many notes" error message:

I went ahead and pulled the trigger - I bought Pianoteq Pro, and the yellow error has stopped. I don't see what the difference is between demo and purchased product, but I'm not going to fix something that seems no longer broken.

For the issue of tone, I just turned up the volume ;-)
Well, it's not totally solved, but I now have something I can enjoy. And I'm actually a little bit serious: By turning up the PA volume, (still to a level low enough to not be obnoxious) I get a little more warm, throaty and deep sound. So maybe the PA was just too throttled for it to "speak". Now with both Pianoteq's Steingraeber Warm and Ivory II's Bosendorfer, the ranges I've talked about sound *very* close to realistic. I'm using Pianoteq's "Steingraeber Warm" with these settings:

Volume: +8.5 dB
Dynamics: 100dB

I figure I shouldn't have to run Pianoteq wide open, and the other pianos (Steinway D, Ant. Petrof, Bluethner) still sound just a bit cheesey in the range A3 to D5. Also, those three aren't as heart-pounding from B1 to G2 compared to the Nord's over-EQ'd "Grand Lady D" preset. So maybe the tone problem hasn't *really* gone away, but I really like the tone of the Steingraeber.

I guess I'm in for some deep tweaking in the future.

Thank you VERY much everyone for your attention and efforts!

Sounds like you have some kind of midi loop going on, and this would result in a phasey sound, if notes are triggered multiple times.
How is your keyboard connected?

Thank you.

I don't think so, a phasey sound is not what I'm hearing, just a very thin tone between A3 and D5. I get a phasey sound if I run the audio out of the Nord thru audio signal path while simultaneously running the MIDI through pianoteq (I'm not doing both at same time--it sounds like crap).

Good thought, but no MIDI loop:
Running a very standard MIDI signal path:
Nord MIDI out->5-pin DIN MIDI cable->MOTU midi express 128 midi interface->USB cable-> USB in to Mac

Pianoteq settings are listening to the NORD, no other board, no other software running that would generate a MIDI signal.

Unless Pianoteq is generating something to create a loop, I'm thinking a loop is not the issue.

Sorry, I haven't read the whole thread, so I'm not sure whether this has been mentioned. But I'd recommend trying low notes with the dumper pedal down. Something like Chopin op. 25 n. 10. This made Pianoteq throttle when I'm on battery on my laptop. Similar issue with Chopin op. 10 n. 1, so I suspect it's mainly due to many notes at the same time. It was okay when I plugged the laptop though. Windows might also be capping for energy saving reasons. Not sure about Mac. Worth checking.

Not using a laptop here.
That's an interesting idea. I've never thought of a laptop actually throttling the CPU in order to save nearly flat batteries,  it makes sense though.
I guess this would very much depend on your power management settings. If you forced it to full power all the time presumably it would allow you to gobble through the batteries in quick time, perhaps even crash on you.

I suppose, you are talking about the "garbage can" Macpro. I am running the same - 4 core 16GB RAM. Pianoteq is running fine with this machine, even as a plugin in Logic Pro with all kind of gimmicks.

In my  experience a load of 20-30% just playing the piano is too high. I do get up to 20 maximum in standalone mode.

That shouldn't be a problem.

As a quick test with a given layered multiple preset in order to force a ridiculous load on standalone Pianoteq layering I tried holding sustain while playing three different keyboards three different instruments with different FX on all three playing as many notes as possible - simple running my hands up the keyboards as fast as possible just to trigger as many notes as possible to max out polyphony (polyphony set to maximum). One keyboard sound even with the sustain changed for the sound to ring on without the aid of a sustain pedal. The result - even when getting into 70% + CPU the system didn't encounter audio problems.

Probably be even easier to test this by setting the three sounds to the same midi channel on the single keyboard, but that's less fun!

Normally it's under 20% here layering three sounds on my CPU but that's not a requirement.

In my  experience a load of 20-30% just playing the piano is too high. I do get up to 20 maximum in standalone mode.

I'm fooling around with the downloaded free trial, and I'm getting a big yellow message in the middle of the screen that says something like "Pianoteq is receiving multiple on/off MIDI messages" (I can't remember the exact remainder of the message, because now I can't seem to replicate the issue).

Thanks for any ideas!

Sounds like you have some kind of midi loop going on, and this would result in a phasey sound, if notes are triggered multiple times.
How is your keyboard connected?

I've been using a mid-2012 MacBookPro since late 2012. No problems running Pianoteq since Version 5 and now have current version without any issues. Have you downloaded Pianoteq more than once, or have 2 different versions running? Re instruments other than the D: you should have both the NY and the Hamburg versions in 7.5.4. Click on Window, click on Preset manager and a drop down menu will show all the instruments on the RH side and clicking on any will provide all the factory presets.  Getting Pianoteq tuned up for a particular system and pair of ears is where the real work begins, but, of course, you have to be reasonably OK with a standard preset before delving into the fine tuning. The package is incredibly flexible, but small changes can make huge and catastrophic/wonderful changes in sounds. Sorry if this appears too basic for you
.

Good to know, thanks Sandalholme! No, only one version downloaded and playing. Thank you for tip on how to load other pianos, and observation about Steinway vs Petrof -- that's my perception as well. Guess I have weak or newbie hands, lol. I'm hoping with 30 params to adjust per note, that this deep tweaking will address this. Not at all, while basic ideas, they are very welcome. Thank you.

<SNIP>the tone of the instrument sounds very wrong.
<SNIP.>morphing or layering modes instead of running through the presets?

@Tone maybe not “very wrong”, (not purely a Wurly or Rhodes--there is some piano tone there) but enough to be disappointing. But the higher registers and the lower ones sound wonderful. I’m finding somewhat similar issues in the same range with the built-in sounds of my Nord Stage 3, my old Yamaha S-80, and my Synthology Ivory II virtual grands. *Gasping with crestfallen face* Could it be my touch? Or maybe I'm getting ear fatigue; I'm starting to question whether the PA's and the room's resonant frequencies are the actual issue.

How can I tell which modes I’m listening to? AFAIK, I was not engaging any settings, just toggling thru the presets. Today I've tried different EQ presets, but nothing exciting is popping out.

<SNIP>loaded up multiple sounds simultaneously
<SNIP>different sounds are more dominant depending on their velocity curve, dynamics, compression and so on.

@Not clear on how I could accidentally “load up multiple sounds”? I haven’t pushed any buttons other than changing presets. Could be they are more dominant, etc; yes, but not truly authentic. Are there settings for these params available in the demo?

<SNIP>haven't turned the internal speakers off!

@No, no internal speakers. All other boards and mixer turned off; audio signal paths for each keyboard is muted. No other software open that could create a signal.

<SNIP>Multiple note on offs not a big issue. The CPU usage ok.

@Thank you, that’s a relief. I have a Hammond XK5 attached as well, but not playing it during these tests—only the Nord. I’ll change the MIDI Devices settings.
The entire message is "Pianoteq is receiving many duplicate note-ON MIDI events (same note, same velocity)". It has happened again today.

<SNIP>do you hear that in the audio demonstrations on the Modartt website?

@Great question. I think so, but I can go back and listen again. If I recollect, I’ve found the Steinways to be rather trebly, though still a little "synthy/harp-like", I preferred the Bluthner, the Petrof, and Steingraeber collections.

Thanks again!

For me, having played acoustic pianos for decades, including Ds, the NY Steinway D feels somewhat weirdly most like an acoustic to play than any other software I've played. It does need some attention for personal circumstances and could only approach the sound of a D in the right acoustical space etc. But that applies to all piano software.

I believe this is down to the dynamic range, or rather the tonal changes through the dynamic range.

Though beautiful sounding the excellent Petrof physical models for instance are relatively more polite sounding. The D models seem to be able to go from whisper quiet to hell and damnation thunderous power.
As I have no frame of real-world personal reference with grand pianos take my comments in this regard with a pinch of salt.
I have seen a few comparison videos where people compare playing the likes of Steingraeber grand with the Steinway, the latter of which requires more heavy-handed playing, where the Steingraeber rewarded a more delicate touch. So bigger stronger hands may prefer the Steinway feel, older smaller or younger hands my benefit from the more responsive action. Perhaps the more delicate action is marginally potentially better for  long-term playing comfort too?

For me, having played acoustic pianos for decades, including Ds, the NY Steinway D feels somewhat weirdly most like an acoustic to play than any other software I've played. It does need some attention for personal circumstances and could only approach the sound of a D in the right acoustical space etc. But that applies to all piano software.