Modartt user forum - Microphone position high above the stage

Re: Microphone position high above the stage

null@example.com (hanysz) — Wed, 13 May 2020 06:06:40 +0000

Thanks, glad you like it!

https://forum.modartt.com/file/3ysid8ak

Re: Microphone position high above the stage

null@example.com (budo) — Tue, 12 May 2020 22:49:43 +0000

please upload an fxp if you have a chance. would like to try it.

Re: Microphone position high above the stage

null@example.com (Mk4UmHa) — Tue, 12 May 2020 14:45:03 +0000

Sounds very good!

Re: Microphone position high above the stage

null@example.com (dklein) — Sun, 10 May 2020 08:57:50 +0000

Listening to it via headphones this morning, I love it! Very pleasant. Perhaps I now know too many details, but I can definitely believe that I am in a gallery above the instrument, or in a balcony of a small theater.

Re: Microphone position high above the stage

null@example.com (hanysz) — Sun, 10 May 2020 06:23:35 +0000

OK, I think what was bothering me most of all was a bit of harshness in the high notes, especially in the Beethoven excerpt (around the 28-30 second mark), as well as in the Grieg (2:09-2:15). I've got something I'm much happier with now, and as a bonus, the bass in the Debussy (1:40-1:50) is also sounding richer. And the start of the Beethoven (18-25 seconds) still has a lot more clarity than the classical recording preset. Thanks everyone for the suggestions!

https://forum.modartt.com/uploads.php?f...ics_v2.mp3

What I've changed:
- Cardioid mics instead of fig 8.
- Add a third mic at "ground level" near the tail end of the piano. This is well away from the hammers, so it picks up more resonance than percussion.
- Bias the reverb towards early reflections, +3dB. (Overall reverb level unchanged.)
- Turn off the EQ3. I didn't realise the classical preset had EQ!

Mic 3 position:

X = +0.525
Y = +3.818
Z = 1.438
Angle = -180.0
Vertical Angle = -15.0

Level is -4dB, compared to -2dB for the "main" microphones.

Re: Microphone position high above the stage

null@example.com (hanysz) — Mon, 04 May 2020 11:47:48 +0000

Thanks for the suggestions. The fig8 was an accident! I meant to choose cardio, but after I'd uploaded the mp3 here, I went back into the Pianoteq interface and realised I'd clicked on the wrong thing.

I've figured out how to load an IR into Pianoteq, and found a few sites where I can download free ones, but I think I need to stay away from convolution reverb. There are just too many to choose from! I could spend the next year just experimenting with these things, when I'm supposed to be playing the piano...

Still, I'll try some variations, and post an update in a few days.

Re: Microphone position high above the stage

null@example.com (Luc Henrion) — Mon, 04 May 2020 11:12:41 +0000

Just for info, an ORTF doesn't use fig8 but cardio mics, always.
Just have a test with the U87 cardio and the C414 cardio. I tend to prefer the AKG, I mean, the "real" one !!!

Re: Microphone position high above the stage

null@example.com (Chopin87) — Mon, 04 May 2020 10:56:42 +0000

I would avoid fig8 for "spacious" recordings, they give too much attack to the sound.

Re: Microphone position high above the stage

null@example.com (Qexl) — Mon, 04 May 2020 09:58:16 +0000

I like what you've done so far hanysz.

You're right, there's probably just a little more reverb in the vid.

Things to consider might include using a convolution type reverb.. you can find "IR" files to download, many free and Pianoteq can load them. Often they come with 2 files (a Left and Right, or quad type) but Pianoteq will handle it properly if you just load the L or R one which is handy. I'm happy with Pianoteq's reverb for many things - but since you mention clarity and space, this might be a good thing to look into. I really like a Sydney Opera House reverb IR file, but you can find real world halls and spaces in abundance in some kits.. a few gigs to download them all - but choose a few and experiment first perhaps.

Things specific to the mics, include checking if you have various compensation buttons ON or OFF.. sometimes for mics which are not close, you won't maybe want proximity compensation (right click the square mic button in the interface to reveal that choice). The other 2 main things, level and delay compensation can be fruitful to toggle until you're happier with the result - as well as stereo width.. maybe a little more width is all you need.

Other than that.. maybe try a little compression to help bring some room tail runnof up into the main sound to give a slight sense of 'room' without needing to push up reverb.

They're things I love experimenting with and you can definitely recreate or create all kinds of real world space with a little time in the tool box.

Cheers, best of luck with it!

Microphone position high above the stage

null@example.com (hanysz) — Sun, 03 May 2020 23:30:47 +0000

I'm trying to replicate the microphone position I've seen in some smaller concert halls. There's a pair of mics suspended from the ceiling, perhaps three or four metres above the stage. It looks like an ORTF pair. You can see it in this video at the 18 minute mark, directly above Andras Schiff's head: https://youtu.be/agN-B5kgzB0?t=1080 Elder Hall in my hometown of Adelaide has the same setup.

I'm looking for a sound that's got a bit more clarity and space than the classical recording preset in PianoTeq, but still a reasonable amount of warmth. Here's what I've got so far.

https://forum.modartt.com/uploads.php?f...h_mics.mp3

For comparison, the exact same MIDI with Steinway D Classical Recording AB:

https://forum.modartt.com/uploads.php?f...ing_AB.mp3

The only difference between the two recordings is the microphone positions. I'm using a single pair of U87-fig8 with positions:

X = +5.257
Y = +1.396
Z = 3.500
Angle = +145.0
Vertical Angle = -23.9

X = +5.257
Y = +1.566
Z = 3.500
Angle = +35.0
Vertical Angle = -23.9

I'm enjoying what it does for softer sounds, but am not quite convinced with the louder passages. I'm wondering if this setup needs a little bit of extra reverb?

I notice that none of the presets have microphones that are more than two metres up. Is there a problem with doing things this way? Has anyone else experimented along these lines? Suggestions welcome!