thanks guys.

so: with a DP-10 I will be able to make the pedal sounds sound different volume with different foot velocity correct?

can a standard usb-keyboard with sustain/controller in handle this or do I need a separate interface for this?

Amen Ptah Ra wrote:

Man, I sincerely appreciate a lot of your effort!

I draw a totally different conclusion!

Say just for the sake of argument you get a pedal such as one from audiofront with its own interface; this still ain’t really a solution to a software problem.

so: with a DP-10 I will be able to make the pedal sounds sound different volume with different foot velocity correct?

can a standard usb-keyboard with sustain/controller in handle this or do I need a separate interface for this?

https://www.forum-pianoteq.com/uploads....olodos.mp3

And pleasant hammer felt ..

You see, sir, you hardly answer my question:

Certainly, I know whenever I make an adjustment to show a "+12.00 dB" increase inside the software Damper Noise NOTE EDIT pane of my PIANOTEQ PRO copy, nothing from the software even remotely resembles an audible 12.00 dB volume bump in piano parameters!

Let me know when you're ready to answer another one of my questions, specifically:

Great record! How well the damper is heard at the end of the track. At the end ... from the 14th minute ... when the quiet sounds begin. On bass notes, the sound of a damper is heard.

I can't actually hear anything changing when adjusting the "damper noise" parameter...

I too hear or discover no change whatsoever whenever I move inside the parameter  —and even from one extreme to the other.

Have any yet been able to discern or pinpoint, exactly, the effects the Damper Noise parameter has on modelled piano sounds overall  —including release sounds?

Which parameter is available as an adjustment inside exclusively PIANOTEQ PRO.

NathanShirley wrote:

Very interesting, thanks for the information. And yes that makes sense, it definitely would not be desirable to compromise the behavior for the sake of cheap pedals.

I wonder though, what are some of the best progressive sustain pedals? If Kawai's pedals aren't sending adequate data, would a Roland or Kurzweil pedal be superior? I believe I remember hearing that pitch bending on Kurzweil keyboards sends far more data than most keyboards, resulting in much smoother pitch bends. Not that I use it a lot, but you can definitely hear the pitch bend increments on my Kawai.

We have several pedals, and the Roland is the best one (gives the finest resolution). I'm not at office so cannot tell the model for now.

The Roland DP-10 is their single pedal with the flip around rubber base plate. It can be switched from on/off to continuous mode. Roland also makes a triple pedal, the RPU-3. I believe all three pedals for that are continuous.

NathanShirley wrote:

Very interesting, thanks for the information. And yes that makes sense, it definitely would not be desirable to compromise the behavior for the sake of cheap pedals.

I wonder though, what are some of the best progressive sustain pedals? If Kawai's pedals aren't sending adequate data, would a Roland or Kurzweil pedal be superior? I believe I remember hearing that pitch bending on Kurzweil keyboards sends far more data than most keyboards, resulting in much smoother pitch bends. Not that I use it a lot, but you can definitely hear the pitch bend increments on my Kawai.

We have several pedals, and the Roland is the best one (gives the finest resolution). I'm not at office so unfortunately cannot tell the model for now.

Very interesting, thanks for the information. And yes that makes sense, it definitely would not be desirable to compromise the behavior for the sake of cheap pedals.

I wonder though, what are some of the best progressive sustain pedals? If Kawai's pedals aren't sending adequate data, would a Roland or Kurzweil pedal be superior? I believe I remember hearing that pitch bending on Kurzweil keyboards sends far more data than most keyboards, resulting in much smoother pitch bends. Not that I use it a lot, but you can definitely hear the pitch bend increments on my Kawai.

We have several pedals, and the Roland is the best one (gives the finest resolution). I'm not at office so cannot tell the model for now.

I wonder though, what are some of the best progressive sustain pedals? If Kawai's pedals aren't sending adequate data, would a Roland or Kurzweil pedal be superior? I believe I remember hearing that pitch bending on Kurzweil keyboards sends far more data than most keyboards, resulting in much smoother pitch bends. Not that I use it a lot, but you can definitely hear the pitch bend increments on my Kawai.

If you pedal very slowly with the Steinway D, it sounds like the pedal modeling noise kicks in over and over for every new value registered by the midi pedal. This isn't really noticeable normally, because the pedal noise is very quiet and it would be unnatural to pedal so slowly.

The problem here (in the case of the modelled sustain woosh), is that the model needs a rich MIDI input. If for example your sustain pedal sends the following (poor) events:
time                        = [0  0.1  0.2  0.3  0.4  0.5  0.6  0.7]
midi sustain velocity = [0   15   30   45   60   75  100 127]
there is no way to make this data smooth, because for example at time t = 0.3 we are not able to predict the next event (here 60, but it could be also 30). Of course one could smooth the data, but at the the unbearable cost of a long delay, which wouldn't be acceptable for fast pedalling. We have tried to find a solution to this problem, to find compromises, and came to the conclusion that there is no solution able to treat a case similar to the one above, except in oversimplifying the model (for example considering only velocities 0 and 127, hence one single type of event), which would be a pity for those having good progressive pedals, sending much finer messages than above.

How the Pianoteq pedal works with the VPС1 pedal

Yes that seems about how my pedal responds. The first time in this video you push the pedal at a relatively normal speed, after that, I would consider most of this to be very slow pedaling (which of course you need from time to time). Bump up the speed a bit from that first pedal and you're really hitting the resolution cap I mentioned.

I suspect the software Damper Noise parameter of the Pro version affects damper noise from piano keys as well as from the sustain pedal and audibly the volume from your release of it, if you ever decide to release it very quickly.

Possibly, Damper Noise as a parameter selection is a reference to damper mechanisms more so than the sound of the felt dampers themselves.

Obviously, I need some clarification!

But, my whole schlep about the sustain pedal registration in Pianoteq is that it might someday sense pedal velocity; just like key velocity has been sensed by methods implored within keyboard hardware, it could happen only inside the software from the half-pedal and continuous pedal capable units.

I see no reason, why it can’t today do that for pedals with a given virtually infinite number of potential sensory points available to software, compared to maximum tri-sensor capabilities left to keyboard keys in hardware!

Similarly, cannot software to some extant make up for a keyboard that lacks tri-sensor technology, one such as mine, whenever I attempt a fast repetition on a single key, and, especially from a depressed sustain pedal!

Personally, I consider myself a fan of the new modelled pedal noise.  To me it's fantastic!  Too bad, nobody considered to note it in a change log and consequently keep either you or me updated to any progress being made.

Certainly, I for one would like to see a new parameter affecting the pedal velocity effect on dampers specifically and possibly another varying damper felt hardness like one might control hammer hardness at a given velocity, if for PIANOTEQ PRO these too are even remotely possible.

Hopefully just as keyboard manufacturers offer a selection out of soft, medium, and hard keyboard key settings, MODARTT in its near future might do something similar just for pedal responsiveness!

I’m being now optimistic, of course.