EvilDragon, you have a SurfacePro4 - how do you set yours up, with and without your external audio card?

- David

Latency is not solely about CPU, it's mostly about how well the audio chip can handle lower latencies. Some built-in solutions in laptops (and tablets etc.) are better than others and will perform at lower latencies regardless of the CPU (more or less). Perhaps you've been lucky

Also, do note that the 1.5 ms latency is just what the driver reports. There are other latencies included: latency from MIDI controller to computer, USB bus latency (both on input AND output), digital-to-analog converter latency... when all of this is summed, you will always get a higher number (though at 64 samples ASIO buffer it should still be below 10 ms, overall).

I didn't realize the internal audio chip played an important role in the latency of ASIO4all Thank you for the information!
And about the 1.5ms, yes, that's why I said that's the (reported) output latency. I'm aware the total number's significantly higher, but I don't perceive it as significantly different than the internal sound and feels good enough so I didn't bother to measure it or improve it further.

That's absolutely the truth. Which is why I will always recommend RME. Yes, Babyface might seem expensive for what it is, but if the best possible performance is what's necessary, RME has the best drivers for this, bar none.

Also, do note that the 1.5 ms latency is just what the driver reports. There are other latencies included: latency from MIDI controller to computer, USB bus latency (both on input AND output), digital-to-analog converter latency... when all of this is summed, you will always get a higher number (though at 64 samples ASIO buffer it should still be below 10 ms, overall).

Yes, as noted by EvilDragon, you can play through the internal speakers, but generally you shouldn't expect it to sound great, because the internal speakers aren't top notch and they're not really optimized for the line-in sound. Maybe top of the line home digital pianos will have a decent enough sound system, but mid-range ones like the HP601/603 won't sound that great when playing VSTs through the internal speakers. But there are external monitors that do sound great and can be had for reasonable sums. Another problem that often occurs when playing through the internal speakers is a ground loop (unwanted noise) that is heard when connecting the piano via USB to the computer and then the sound output back to the piano. This can be mitigated but I'm not sure it's worth it for mid-range pianos.
Personally I have two monitors (Focal Alpha 65) placed on top of my Roland piano on some IsoPads (to avoid the piano case resonating) and the quality is fantastic. Feels as immersive as I could possibly want.

For latency, RME are most likely the best out there, but they are priced accordingly. However, very good results can be achieved with entry-mid priced interfaces such as Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 2nd gen or the Steinberg UR22 mkII (which I have). You can use them with virtually unperceivable latency. There's also a generic driver Asio4All which can be installed on any computer and doesn't require an external interface. If the computer is reasonably powerful, you may also get very low latency this way (probably as low as the two interfaces named above).

mcoll wrote:

In the end it's a matter of preference, but I don't see the VPC1 as being better action-wise. For the GF2 action that may be another matter, but that's more expensive.
And don't worry about the MIDI capabilities. Pretty much any quality digital piano does the same thing over MIDI. The significant differences are in how the keys feel.

Thanks for your input. And shame on me for doing a poor/too quick research on the midi area of things. I some how overlooked that midi communication, today is mainly used over a USB connection and didn't even considered the HP/LX Roland pianos can be used as a standard midi keyboard too.....I blame my age and the old acquired knowledge about midi from the ninties!  ;-P

However, would it be possible to let Pianoteq play out of the speakers on the HP/LX models?  And would there be a detectable delay from key press to sound output from the speakers....I wonder?  The digital processing and transport back and forth, will enevitable create a longer delay of some sort.....question is, how many extra miliseconds are we talking about and does it matter?  ;-)

But the signal path going through a computer running pianoteq back and forth over usb, is "significantly" longer than just using the dedicated onboard modelling sounds, yes?  :-)

I have been reporting on nice results--especially with the latest update 6.2, playing on the internal LX-17 speakers. I now have my MacBook pretty much always next to the piano--can't do without the beautiful sound all the different models Pianoteq make. To increase responsiveness, I had to modify the velocity curve from linear to go a bit higher, but not as high as for Pianoteq 6.1. The trills especially are a good test--tweak the velocity curve until they come through as quickly as with internal sound. Good luck.

However, would it be possible to let Pianoteq play out of the speakers on the HP/LX models?  And would there be a detectable delay from key press to sound output from the speakers....I wonder?  The digital processing and transport back and forth, will enevitable create a longer delay of some sort.....question is, how many extra miliseconds are we talking about and does it matter?  ;-)

If HP/LX models have audio inputs, then yes it should be possible - you disable local control on them (it would still send MIDI out, it just wouldn't trigger internal engine), and then route output from your audio interface to HP/LX.

Latency would solely depend on quality of ASIO drivers used by the interface. Here I absolutely recommend anything by RME.

In the end it's a matter of preference, but I don't see the VPC1 as being better action-wise. For the GF2 action that may be another matter, but that's more expensive.
And don't worry about the MIDI capabilities. Pretty much any quality digital piano does the same thing over MIDI. The significant differences are in how the keys feel.

Thanks for your input. And shame on me for doing a poor/too quick research on the midi area of things. I some how overlooked that midi communication, today is mainly used over a USB connection and didn't even considered the HP/LX Roland pianos can be used as a standard midi keyboard too.....I blame my age and the old acquired knowledge about midi from the ninties!  ;-P

However, would it be possible to let Pianoteq play out of the speakers on the HP/LX models?  And would there be a detectable delay from key press to sound output from the speakers....I wonder?  The digital processing and transport back and forth, will enevitable create a longer delay of some sort.....question is, how many extra miliseconds are we talking about and does it matter?  ;-)

But the signal path going through a computer running pianoteq back and forth over usb, is "significantly" longer than just using the dedicated onboard modelling sounds, yes?  :-)