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		<title><![CDATA[Modartt user forum - Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
		<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?id=5645</link>
		<description><![CDATA[The most recent posts in Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?.]]></description>
		<lastBuildDate>Fri, 13 Apr 2018 16:38:23 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953782#p953782</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Phase issues ! Really !<br />A correct ORTF pair recording will give you the feeling that the piano is sitting exactly between your speakers, in a well defined place, whereas an &quot;out of phase&quot; recording will not let you &quot;see&quot; where the instrument might be !</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (Luc Henrion)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Fri, 13 Apr 2018 16:38:23 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953782#p953782</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953781#p953781</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Thank you.&nbsp; I read that with only partial understanding of the potential problems (such as phase subtraction when two channels that may be OK in stereo are purposefully fed to one speaker element set for mono).&nbsp; </p><p>I have some other websites that I just found but don&#039;t have time this morning to read, but will get back to it either later today or tomorrow.</p><p>Luc, one other thing that I don&#039;t understand (for the virtual microphones in Pianoteq in particular) is why some microphone positions on particular VST pianos give the stereo imaging impression that the sound is coming all around me, as if I am bathing in it, as compared to others that have discreet directional qualities (for my &#039;Player-simulations&#039;, I prefer distinct directionality, or as much as is present from a real piano).&nbsp; The Grotrian is one of those pianos that sounds great, but for which I frequently hear non-directional characteristics to its sound when I try to do &#039;virtual&#039; Player-position presets, no matter how I distribute the microphones.&nbsp; Do you know why this might be?</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (dklein)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Fri, 13 Apr 2018 11:34:21 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953781#p953781</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953780#p953780</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Sorry but you&#039;re sure to get phase issues if you place your mics this way. Have a look here:<br /><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ORTF_stereo_technique">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ORTF_stereo_technique</a></p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (Luc Henrion)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Fri, 13 Apr 2018 08:33:46 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953780#p953780</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953775#p953775</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>You all are silly... but I like it.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (Kramster1)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 12 Apr 2018 21:25:08 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953775#p953775</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953774#p953774</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>But then I need the snow, right?&nbsp; I don&#039;t think it&#039;ll last in Florida (but it made for a nice dessert after a big dinner!).</p><p><a href="https://photos.app.goo.gl/OB5pWOIWZBpfxePm2">https://photos.app.goo.gl/OB5pWOIWZBpfxePm2</a></p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (dklein)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 12 Apr 2018 20:00:01 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953774#p953774</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953772#p953772</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<div class="quotebox"><cite>dklein wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Gilles, maybe I should go to my nearest Cabane A Sucre for a few liters of L&#039;eau Erable - do you think soaking the lower workings in that may help?&nbsp; But then it might attract too many ants!</p></blockquote></div><p>You may have better results with the &quot;tire d&#039;érable&quot; quite sticky taffy-like stuff <i class="far fa-smile smiley"></i></p><p><a href="https://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://jaimelerable.ca/sites/default/files/styles/2013-640-390/public/recettes/fpaq_photos_web_640x390_tire.jpg?itok%3DfbkQ2LdY&amp;imgrefurl=http://jaimelerable.ca/recettes/tire-derable&amp;h=390&amp;w=640&amp;tbnid=zrOGfcLJiJoDnM:&amp;tbnh=160&amp;tbnw=263&amp;usg=__Np-N9lkcXikkOxT3eOl12AOFqAY%3D&amp;vet=1&amp;docid=40sP_F6HtkwFfM&amp;sa=X&amp;ved=0ahUKEwjEnoCqn7XaAhWqY98KHQhGArsQ9QEIKjAA">https://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=htt...sQ9QEIKjAA</a></p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (Gilles)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 12 Apr 2018 17:28:56 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953772#p953772</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953770#p953770</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Yes, Gilles, the floor mic situation sounds bad!</p><p>For my piano, the best type of sustain is the technique of &quot;finger pedaling&quot;, as I learned on a Pianist Magazine video. </p><p>I have tried both glue and wood screws to tighten up the bittom of my piano&#039;s cabinet. But it&#039;s likely an ancient rebuild with non-original wood and mechanism (even before I replaced some deteriorating parts with new ones of red oak).</p><p>Gilles, maybe I should go to my nearest Cabane A Sucre for a few liters of L&#039;eau Erable - do you think soaking the lower workings in that may help?&nbsp; But then it might attract too many ants!</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (dklein)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 12 Apr 2018 16:50:31 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953770#p953770</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953768#p953768</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Interesting live comparison with common mics and speakers, so identical listening conditions! I think uprights may have more noisy pedals because they are somehow amplified by the cabinet since they are inside it most of the way. Many years ago, I recorded myself playing my large Kawai with two PZM mics (Radio-Shack) on the floor...You can imagine how loud the pedal sounded... <i class="far fa-smile-wink smiley"></i></p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (Gilles)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 12 Apr 2018 11:52:19 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953768#p953768</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953764#p953764</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>OK!&nbsp; A start in the recording and comparison business... I received my 2 AKG P420s from Amazon today (thanks for the suggestion, Luc) and they are more pleasing and slightly warmer than the AT2050.&nbsp; Plus, this time, since you pointed out that I have 2 ears, I bought two microphones [ :-) ].</p><p>Here are uncompressed (well, compressed as MP3s but not with audio compression in Cubase), non-equalized, first analog recordings.&nbsp; The first is of a nervous me playing a Beethoven-like bit mated to Coffee Shop Boogie.&nbsp; First you hear the real piano (1885 Steinway F), and then Pianoteq (with a modified Steinway B Improv preset that could use more tweaking).&nbsp; The second is the same set-up, this time versus the Grotrian Intimate in a Player configuration (I think that I mistakenly called it &quot;Grotrian Improv&quot; in my audio recording).&nbsp; The third is a brief improvisation in A-minor using just the Grotrian Intimate as Player preset - and it features my old piano&#039;s really noisy sustain pedal, which I can&#039;t seem to quiet - yes, it&#039;s almost this loud in real life as well.&nbsp; The audio speakers are Emotiva Stealth 8&#039;s and Airmotiv 4&#039;s, along with their Bas-X 8&quot; subwoofer.&nbsp; Also, when I say &quot;turn off the Steinway&quot;, what I really mean is that I am engaging the rubber-and-aluminum Stop-Rail so that the hammers on the piano don&#039;t contact the strings.</p><p><a href="http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/uploads.php?file=Beethoven%20sort-of.mp3">http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/uploads.p...ort-of.mp3</a><br /><a href="http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/uploads.php?file=Bit-o-Blues.mp3">http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/uploads.p...-Blues.mp3</a><br /><a href="http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/uploads.php?file=Wednesday%20Improv%20in%20A-minor.mp3">http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/uploads.p...-minor.mp3</a></p><p>The microphones are both set as cardioid, to either side of me, and facing the middle of the piano, but higher than my head.&nbsp; Here is a photo showing the set-up in my living room:</p><p><a href="https://photos.app.goo.gl/HVdn0WrgJ1kqpwGq2">https://photos.app.goo.gl/HVdn0WrgJ1kqpwGq2</a></p><p>It&#039;s a start, and now I&#039;m getting a flavor of how black an art recording is (I&#039;m not referring to the piano or the gear - just the magic that I am yet to learn).&nbsp; Other than the piano playing, which needs the most work, I need to play with equalization to kill some of the bass and increase the treble a bit, try different microphone positions (the microphones higher than my head hear the upwards-facing Stealth 8&#039;s differently than my ears do), and try to use presets that are as close as possible to my piano by my ears using &quot;Player&quot; position.&nbsp; Also, what I really should do is first record a MIDI file on my acoustic piano via the QRS PNOscan MIDI bar while the Stop Rail is disengaged, and then play that MIDI file through the Pianoteq VSTs in Cubase.</p><p>Anyway, it&#039;s a start...</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (dklein)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 12 Apr 2018 02:45:16 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953764#p953764</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953746#p953746</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Thank you.</p><p>Well, this morning I figured out that I had an incorrect monitor and recording set up with Cubase. This morning I was able to make some recordings both with the real piano and the VST pianos, playing within Cubase. I am still not perfect on loading a MIDI file and playing it back through the VST while recording into a separate tract, but I did manage to do that once, although I was only able to play it back by clicking on the recorded &quot;sample track&quot; to hear it – otherwise it didn&#039;t work. So, I am getting there.</p><p>I ordered two of the 420s, and will return the 2050. The 2050 wasn&#039;t bad, but it had a bit of a plasticky, artificial sound. I will see if the 420s sound better. The beauty of ordering online with return fees only paying Amazon shipping isn&#039;t all that bad…</p><p>… Making progress!</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (dklein)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Tue, 10 Apr 2018 10:43:40 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953746#p953746</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953745#p953745</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>You have to perform some routing in Cubase, but it&#039;s perfectly possible to get PIanoteq only, without monitoring the mic(s). Don&#039;t use ASIO4all: it&#039;s designed for internal soundcards that have no ASIO capabilities, but your Steinberg UR22, coming from the inventors of ASIO, is certainly capable of it!<br />Maybe you should check if you have the tatest driver here:<br /><a href="https://www.steinberg.net/en/support/downloads_hardware/yamaha_steinberg_usb_driver.html">https://www.steinberg.net/en/support/do...river.html</a></p><p>I&#039;m suprised by your comment on the AT2050, it&#039;s a really good mic, the P420 will probably not be better... and if I were you, I would certainly buy a second one, instead of a P420 to achieve a stereo setup. Look at the position of your mic(s): just a few inches makes a huge difference.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (Luc Henrion)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Tue, 10 Apr 2018 09:52:25 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953745#p953745</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953741#p953741</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>with apologies, i don&#039;t have anything meaningful to add to this conversation, but just wanted to say what a fascinating &amp; valuable thread this is, Dave et al!&nbsp; &#039;looking forward to hearing more about your continuing adventures in the digital/analog audio space.&nbsp; <i class="far fa-laugh smiley"></i></p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (_DJ_)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Tue, 10 Apr 2018 00:14:01 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953741#p953741</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953732#p953732</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Thanks.&nbsp; </p><p>I think that the cable actually was my problem.&nbsp; When I couldn&#039;t record with the new AT2050, I was using an XLR at the mic to 1/4&quot; phono at the Steinberg UR22 mkII.&nbsp; I swapped for an XLR to XLR cable, and I could then record.&nbsp; So I went back to the Shure 58A, which now also works much better than it did (though it&#039;s not as good as the AT2050, which themselves aren&#039;t great.&nbsp; </p><p>I was able to record my acoustic piano, but I have yet figured out if I can use the Steinberg both to output to monitor speakers as well as to record what Pianoteq sounds like through the monitor speakers.&nbsp; I don&#039;t know whether that will work by not running the MIDI through Cubase, or perhaps through ASIO4ALL separate from the recording microphone.&nbsp; I keep getting feedback as the monitor speakers are playing monitor output along with Pianoteq, when what I want is to run the monitor function to my headphones but Pianoteq to the speakers.&nbsp; If I get it to work, then I can compare acoustic to Pianoteq.</p><p>Does this take two external soundcards/audio interfaces (UR22 mkIIs)?&nbsp; One for production acoustic output and one for input?&nbsp; Understand that I already can record Pianoteq as synthesis from MIDI, and even mix that with acoustic piano, but that&#039;s not what I&#039;m trying to do, as I am trying to record Pianoteq as if it were an acoustic piano.</p><p>Thanks for the P420 tips.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (dklein)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Mon, 09 Apr 2018 10:39:39 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953732#p953732</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953730#p953730</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>P420. (I really used both).</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (Luc Henrion)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Mon, 09 Apr 2018 06:51:36 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953730#p953730</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Re: Microphone choice for analog piano and Pianoteq recordings?]]></title>
			<link>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953728#p953728</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Hey, guys, I am in the US - While I can get the P420 easily, the Line Audio CM3 has to be ordered via eBay or similar through a transcontinental agent via France or Belgium - Any suggestions as to which is best for piano recording a couple of feet from the piano?</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[null@example.com (dklein)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Mon, 09 Apr 2018 04:18:51 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://forum.modartt.com/viewtopic.php?pid=953728#p953728</guid>
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