stevedoz wrote:

Kengrayfield wrote:

Interesting. Do you just add the plugin downstream of Pianoteq? Also, is this only for Beyerdynamic headphones?

Edit: Just found out that it is only for Beyerdynamic headphones.

For those who are on Windows, you can use Equalizer APO, and import autoeq.app correction to achieve similar results for other headphones.

Interesting thanks. Do you know if there are any videos explaining this for non technical people? Cheers

Look up Equalizer APO, which is a EQ and audio effect driver for Windows. Install it first, and then you can install the Peace GUI for the driver. Once you did all of that, head over to autoeq.app and look up your headphone model, download the eq file in Equalizer APO as the format and load it in Peace. That's how I set mine up.

Many thanks

Pianistically wrote:

Kengrayfield wrote:

I found a free binaural vst plugin! https://anaglyph.dalembert.upmc.fr/

Okay, after trying the plug in, the sound effect is pretty interesting. It definitely feels out of the head. But it changes the tone of the piano too much. And the high CPU utilization makes it difficult to use in a live performance for me.

This is the problem with these kind of DSP plugins. On top of the pianoteq latency , it adds the transformation of sound due to adjusted HRTF i.e. receive info  from the headphones, recalculate HTRF filter based on data received from headphones and transform the audio. Measurements made on NX waves  report added latencies of 15+ ms  which imho is not good for live playing as if you are in the 5 -10 ms latency with pianoteq , your latency range now becomes 20-25+ms which is just too much for live playing and only suitable for listening to offline renditions of midi file.

Pianoteq already does binaural processing, what is needed is a spacial audio format for this processing that Pianoteq could incorporate as it now uses wav files for reverb processing. That standard is called "SOFA".

https://www.sofaconventions.org/mediawi...Acoustics)

  using SOFA inside Pianoteq with OSC compatible head tracker is probably a better way to go for latency as you bypass the delay that Waves NX adds to the signal chain.

Kengrayfield wrote:

I found a free binaural vst plugin! https://anaglyph.dalembert.upmc.fr/

Okay, after trying the plug in, the sound effect is pretty interesting. It definitely feels out of the head. But it changes the tone of the piano too much. And the high CPU utilization makes it difficult to use in a live performance for me.

This is the problem with these kind of DSP plugins. On top of the pianoteq latency , it adds the transformation of sound due to adjusted HRTF i.e. receive info  from the headphones, recalculate HTRF filter based on data received from headphones and transform the audio. Measurements made on NX waves  report added latencies of 15+ ms  which imho is not good for live playing as if you are in the 5 -10 ms latency with pianoteq , your latency range now becomes 20-25+ms which is just too much for live playing and only suitable for listening to offline renditions of midi file.

Pianoteq already does binaural processing, what is needed is a spacial audio format for this processing that Pianoteq could incorporate as it now uses wav files for reverb processing. That standard is called "SOFA".

https://www.sofaconventions.org/mediawi...Acoustics)

I found a free binaural vst plugin! https://anaglyph.dalembert.upmc.fr/

Okay, after trying the plug in, the sound effect is pretty interesting. It definitely feels out of the head. But it changes the tone of the piano too much. And the high CPU utilization makes it difficult to use in a live performance for me.

This is the problem with these kind of DSP plugins. On top of the pianoteq latency , it adds the transformation of sound due to adjusted HRTF i.e. receive info  from the headphones, recalculate HTRF filter based on data received from headphones and transform the audio. Measurements made on NX waves  report added latencies of 15+ ms  which imho is not good for live playing as if you are in the 5 -10 ms latency with pianoteq , your latency range now becomes 20-25+ms which is just too much for live playing and only suitable for listening to offline renditions of midi file.

Okay, after trying the plug in, the sound effect is pretty interesting. It definitely feels out of the head. But it changes the tone of the piano too much. And the high CPU utilization makes it difficult to use in a live performance for me.

Hi Yves,

There is way to listen binaurally whilst he's tracking using the nx waves and headphone LABS apps. I worked it out last night.

In the Beyerdynamic app, turn off speaker simulation. This will automatically become binaural. You won't need to select custom headphones setting on either the Beyerdynamic or Waves nx plugins. When everything is setup correctly, you will get a binaural head tracking result.

Warmest regards,

Chris

Hi,

Thanks for your test but I think we are not speaking of the same thing. NX waves simulates a binaural listening of 2 monitors in front of you. In your test when you turn of speakers simulation in LABS plugin you just keep headphone equalization of the plugin and if nx waves is active you add nx to the Labs equalization, The head tracker works but it is just the NX waves plugin (virtual monitors).  I think
Binaural preset in pianoteq simulates the direct soundboard sound diffusion of the piano, without any monitors. That's why I'd like to pilote headphone positions in "pianoteq binaural preset" with signal of the tracker.
Sorry if I am not very clear.

Regards
Yves

Hi Chris,

Thank you for all this informations. I use an iPad (iOS) on which I run the Pianoteq standalone version. It is always connected to my keyboard and audio interface. It's up and running in 2 seconds, no fan, no noise, It's absolutely perfect for simply playing piano. When I need effects or other VST, I use Studio One on windows. That's how I use NX Wave after Pianoteq. I downloaded the Beyer plugin so I will compare them ( I dont own Beyer headphone so it won't be perfect for the curve). In both cases, these plugins simulate listening on monitors but not listening to a real piano. Pianoteq has the binaural mode for this, which only lacks head tracking (binaural without head mouvement can't be totaly realistic)
It would be interesting to use the tracking data from NX, convert it into a MIDI signal, and use it to control the positions of Pianoteq's ‘binaural headphones’. But I don't have the necessary skills. Maybe headtracking in pianoteq 10...
Regards
Yves

Translated with DeepL.com (free version)

Hi Yves,

There is way to listen binaurally whilst he's tracking using the nx waves and headphone LABS apps. I worked it out last night.

In the Beyerdynamic app, turn off speaker simulation. This will automatically become binaural. You won't need to select custom headphones setting on either the Beyerdynamic or Waves nx plugins. When everything is setup correctly, you will get a binaural head tracking result.

Warmest regards,

Chris

Thank you for all this informations. I use an iPad (iOS) on which I run the Pianoteq standalone version. It is always connected to my keyboard and audio interface. It's up and running in 2 seconds, no fan, no noise, It's absolutely perfect for simply playing piano. When I need effects or other VST, I use Studio One on windows. That's how I use NX Wave after Pianoteq. I downloaded the Beyer plugin so I will compare them ( I dont own Beyer headphone so it won't be perfect for the curve). In both cases, these plugins simulate listening on monitors but not listening to a real piano. Pianoteq has the binaural mode for this, which only lacks head tracking (binaural without head mouvement can't be totaly realistic)
It would be interesting to use the tracking data from NX, convert it into a MIDI signal, and use it to control the positions of Pianoteq's ‘binaural headphones’. But I don't have the necessary skills. Maybe headtracking in pianoteq 10...
Regards
Yves

Translated with DeepL.com (free version)

sigasa wrote:

sigasa wrote:

I think this would work well in conjunction with the waves nx software (the latter just for the head movements detection. This would provide very, very realistic results.

I will download waves nx for IOS and test it.

Warmest regards,

Chris

Yup, works a treat

Chris

Hi Chris
How do you use nx wave ios with pianoteq? I downloaded it but I am not familiar with ios (I only use ios for the standalone version of pianoteq).

Have you managed to combine nx wave headtracker and the beyer plugin? How...

Many thanks.
Yves

Hi Yves,

I'm using a Mini Mac IOS (Tahoe version - just upgraded it)

(Both the Beyerdynamic Headphones LABS and Waves nx plugins are available for Windows also, so if you are more familiar with Windows, download for Windows).

I'm using garageband as a VST Host. You could use your preferred VST Host.

I simply opened up Pianoteq (9.2) as my first plugin. Then Beyerdynamic's Headphone LABS as the second plugin in the chain, then finally Waves nx head tracker plugin.

I don't combine the headphone plugin and nx head tracker plugin. They are opened in series after Pianoteq. I think most if not all VST Hosts will allow you to open several plugins at the same time.

If you manage to get this far, I'll share my settings.

I remember your older posts from several years ago about nx head tracking software. Those posts of your were what inspired me to by the Waves nx head tracker and the waves nx head tracker plugin in the first place. So I owe you a big thank you. THANK YOU Yves!!!

If I am able to help you further, I will do my best. If anyone else what like to help Yves too, that would be greatly appreciated.

Warmest regards,

Chris

p.s. Actually, I think the term is Mac OS, not Mac iOS. I think iOS is for iPhone and iPad???

Apologies for any confusion caused!

"Equalizer APO, and import autoeq.app correction"... AFAIK, this is "only" an EQ, while Beyer solution also includes "crossfeed" (and more ?) for a better speakers setup simulation.

Equalizer APO (with Peace GUI) has crossfeed effect too. But the key thing with autoeq is that you are not limited to only Beyerdynamic headphones.

Also, with Equalizer APO, you basically are open to a whole new way of audio effects for the native Windows audio. You can even install vst effects, like noise suppression, convolution, etc.

Kengrayfield wrote:

sigasa wrote:

Beyerdynamic has released a free headphone correction plugin. And it's brilliant. I'm hearing Pianoteq like never before on my DT770 PRO LE's. So much more authentic. Highly recommended.

I'll post the link shortly...

Warmest regards,

Chris

Here it is...

beyerdynamic HEADPHONE LAB https://share.google/xIYn3lzikRrpf2bjd

Interesting. Do you just add the plugin downstream of Pianoteq? Also, is this only for Beyerdynamic headphones?

Edit: Just found out that it is only for Beyerdynamic headphones.

For those who are on Windows, you can use Equalizer APO, and import autoeq.app correction to achieve similar results for other headphones.

Interesting thanks. Do you know if there are any videos explaining this for non technical people? Cheers

Look up Equalizer APO, which is a EQ and audio effect driver for Windows. Install it first, and then you can install the Peace GUI for the driver. Once you did all of that, head over to autoeq.app and look up your headphone model, download the eq file in Equalizer APO as the format and load it in Peace. That's how I set mine up.

sigasa wrote:

Luc Henrion wrote:

"Equalizer APO, and import autoeq.app correction"... AFAIK, this is "only" an EQ, while Beyer solution also includes "crossfeed" (and more ?) for a better speakers setup simulation.

I think this would work well in conjunction with the waves nx software (the latter just for the head movements detection. This would provide very, very realistic results.

I will download waves nx for IOS and test it.

Warmest regards,

Chris

Yup, works a treat

Chris

Hi Chris
How do you use nx wave ios with pianoteq? I downloaded it but I am not familiar with ios (I only use ios for the standalone version of pianoteq).

Have you managed to combine nx wave headtracker and the beyer plugin? How...

Many thanks.
Yves

Luc Henrion wrote:

"Equalizer APO, and import autoeq.app correction"... AFAIK, this is "only" an EQ, while Beyer solution also includes "crossfeed" (and more ?) for a better speakers setup simulation.

I think this would work well in conjunction with the waves nx software (the latter just for the head movements detection. This would provide very, very realistic results.

I will download waves nx for IOS and test it.

Warmest regards,

Chris

Yup, works a treat

Chris

"Equalizer APO, and import autoeq.app correction"... AFAIK, this is "only" an EQ, while Beyer solution also includes "crossfeed" (and more ?) for a better speakers setup simulation.

I think this would work well in conjunction with the waves nx software (the latter just for the head movements detection. This would provide very, very realistic results.

I will download waves nx for IOS and test it.

Warmest regards,

Chris